gjk@talcott.UUCP (Greg Kuperberg) (04/03/85)
... > My attempts to challenge the *assumptions* of Libertarianism are entirely > legitimate and cannot be refuted by simply labelling such challenges > as "strawman" arguments. > tim sevener whuxl!orb Now that we've had a flame from an "anti-Libertarian" about having his articles labelled strawman arguments, I must ask the $64,000 question: Exactly what do you think that the Libertarians believe, Tim? The last time someone asked this question, he got a bunch of responses to the tune of "Libertarianism is the root of all evil, while Socialism is the human race's salvation and destiny." But I don't want anything like that. No, Tim, imagine a gentle, warm-hearted, and intelligent Libertarian. They do exist, you know. Anyway, what do you think such a person would believe? What would be the backbone of his/her philosophy? And why am I posting this to the net instead of mailing it? Because this is not just a question to Tim, this is an opinion poll. If you feel your definition of Libertarianism shows a unique perspective, then please post your answer to the question in the previous paragraph. If you don't, then please mail your opinion to me. I will summarize the results after a week or so. Also, please specify whether or not you are pro-, anti-, or neutral to Libertarianism. -- Greg Kuperberg harvard!talcott!gjk "No Marxist can deny that the interests of socialism are higher than the interests of the right of nations to self-determination." -Lenin, 1918
fagin@ucbvax.ARPA (Barry Steven Fagin) (04/04/85)
Hey guys, please don't dignify Tim's posting with a reply. We know how we feel, we've tried to explain it rationally, and we're all pissed at Tim's accusations, so let's just let it slide. Instead, let's stick to the issues, show the libertarian perspective, and patiently explain why we think it makes sense. --Barry -- Barry Fagin @ University of California, Berkeley
rdz@ccice5.UUCP (Robert D. Zarcone) (04/04/85)
> > And why am I posting this to the net instead of mailing it? Because this > is not just a question to Tim, this is an opinion poll. If you feel your > definition of Libertarianism shows a unique perspective, then please post > your answer to the question in the previous paragraph. If you don't, then > please mail your opinion to me. I will summarize the results after a week > or so. Also, please specify whether or not you are pro-, anti-, or neutral > to Libertarianism. > -- > Greg Kuperberg > harvard!talcott!gjk > Talk about a fire starter! OK, I'll bite. I don't like Libertarianism (and generally, libertarians). I don't like any political, social, or philosophical order that would determine "might makes right". I know that's not a "definition of Libertarianism", but it is, in a nut shell, a pretty good indication of the underlying philosophy of this movement. BTW, Libertarians, don't flame me. I consider you as viable an alternative to the Republicrats and Democrans as I do the Right-to-Life or Wrokers World parties. Therefore, I see no reason to treat your attacks with any more concern than I would their's. *** REPLACE THIS LINE WITH YOUR MESSAGE ***
laura@utzoo.UUCP (Laura Creighton) (04/08/85)
I am not clear where you got the notion that libertarianism is connected to ``might makes right'', unless it is that libertarians are rather quick to tell you that they will protect their property rights. Instead libertarians of all sorts think that certain human rights are sacred, which seems counter to the ``might makes right'' philosophy. There is some disagreement as to what these rights are, and there is some disagreement as to how best to see that these rights are respected, and there is disagreement as to whom should have these rights (no, no, not whether Blacks or Jews or some race should have them but -- what about tourists in libertaria? and children?) but I haven't seen any disagreement that there *are* rights. Where did you get this strange notion about libertarianism? Have I been sloppy? By the way, I am about hald done writing a huge ``magnum opus'' :-) which explains (for once and for all :-) ) where morals and rights come from. A fairly large proportion of libertarians will be in agreement with this statement (with a lot of quibbles. Libertarians love to quibble.) It plunks me quite solidly in the ``might does not make right'' camp. I will post this soon -- I think that it may be another ``life, the universe and everything explained -- in 7 parts''. Laura Creighton utzoo!laura