maddog@tolerant.UUCP (Bill Arnett) (07/22/85)
The following is a summary of a Compuserve Conference with ANDY HERTZFELD
from last week:
(Bill Gibson) Andy how has Steve Jobs been taking the recent reorganization
at Apple?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Well, he, like everyone else is trying to adjust to it.
The last time I talked with him he was still pretty upset.
(James Schenck) ANDY = I'd like to know what is happening with SWITCHER
release.
(Andy Hertzfeld) I'm currently on 4.0, which has been thoroughly tested
and should be uploaded here and shipped to dealers before the end
of the month. I'm not working on it anymore until the fall.
(Fred Humbert) Andy, what would you envision as Apples next
MAJOR move with the Mac, color, open box, or size of screen.
(Andy Hertzfeld) I think color is the least likely of the things you
mentioned. There are degrees of "open box"; it's certain the next Mac
will be more open hardware-wise, but I'm not sure by how much. A bigger
screen is real easy to do and it's likely that you'll see a variety of
screen sizes.
(Steve Ura) Andy- Will the finder in ROM hurt those
with non-Apple 512K and/or Hyperdrives?
(Andy Hertzfeld) The Finder will not be in ROM in the 128K ROMs. Most
everybody will be able to easily upgrade to the 128K ROMs since all Macs
have socketed ROMs.
(Mark Kopec) Andy, with firms such as Atari offering a new, low-cost
alternative to the 512k Mac, what effect do feel these new machines will
have on Apple sales and the company in general.
(Andy Hertzfeld) I have an Atari 520 ST and while I'm impressed with some
aspects of it, in general I think it's nothing like the Mac software-wise.
The net effect of low cost Mac imitators will probably be to push the
price of the Mac lower, which is good for the customers, and maybe even
good for Apple.
(John Gallaugher) ANDY, In your opinion... What is the best development
system for the Macintosh.. and WHY ?
(Andy Hertzfeld) A lot depends on what languages you like and your
personal working style. I write all my programs in assembly and use the
MDS system. I expect the forthcoming "MPS" system from Apple (which
includes a C and Pascal compiler, as well as an assembler) to be the most
popular environment if it ever gets finished.
(Bob Abeles) What delights do you have in store for us?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Well, I'm trying to take it easy this summer. I'm
currently working on a double-sized cursor hack for some near-sighted
MAUGers who requested it. I'm planning some major enhancements to
Switcher in the Fall (disk based partitions) and a few other things
that are too ephemeral to talk about now
(Dave Vargo) What are your impressions of the Amiga, is it a more worthy
competitor to the Mac than the Atari St.
(Andy Hertzfeld) I don't have an Amiga, but I played with one. It has
significantly more capabilities than the Atari, but it will be priced a
lot more expensively. The Amiga's sound capabilities are truly
great, blowing away both the Mac and the Atari. I think software
is what matters the most, and both atari and Amiga are WAY behind
the Mac in that regard.
(Fred Humbert) Andy, what do you know about Haba's double sided drive
and why isn't any body at apple rushing to get one out?
(Andy Hertzfeld) I haven't seen or tried haba's drive, but I would avoid
it as its sure to be different than Apple's. Apple's double sided drive
is great, it seeks and changes speed much faster than the old one. They
are rushing to get it out, but they are a big company so things often seem
to move slowly. I would expect it to be available around the end of
the year, but don't quote me.
('Bill C/Alt) There has been much speculation about the next version of the
MAC having a 68010 or a 68020 Processor. Comment on the possibility and
are these processors capable of being compatable with the 68000 (upward)
(Andy Hertzfeld) Exception handling is different on the 010 and 020
so there can be some compatibility problems. The new (128K) ROM will be
compatible with both the 010 and 020 but everybody's applications
may not be. The truth is that Apple has at least 3 candidates for the
"next Mac" under development so its hard to say which ones will be
for real.
(Martin Shelby) Hi, Andy. I was one of many wowed at Drexel...
Just what will be on the 128K ROM? Why was the system and finder
disk-based? Time limitations?
(Andy Hertzfeld) The Finder is disk based because we knew we didn't have
it right yet. There were also severe space limitations. We tried to put
the most important stuff in the ROM. By the way, they're out
of space on the 128K ROM now and might have to leave some
planned stuff out. It's funny how you never have enough space.
(Andy Hertzfeld) The Switcher supports a limited form of multi-tasking;
applications have to be modified to take advantage of it. The new version
of ThunderScan can scan in the background under Switcher now.
(David Rose) Andy: How about sushi this Wed the 24th?
(Howard S. Goldberg) the amiga and the st are both color.
any chance of the Mac having color soon
(Andy Hertzfeld) eventually be a color Mac, but not until the second half
of 1986 at the earliest
(Dennis Alvernaz) Andy, what performance in speed is probable
with new ROMS and where?
(Andy Hertzfeld) The resource manager is the single place that was speeded
up the most. Beleive it or not, but QuickDraw was significantly speeded
up, too, as well as a bunch of other places. It's difficult to say since
every application does things a little differently, but new ROMs
coupled with the new 3.5 drives cut application
launch time at least in half, usually more
(Andy Pickett) Andy, any word on the 20 meg that plugs
Andy, any word on the 20 meg that plugs into the disk-drive port, how can
we get info? And... What are your thoughts on NEON! by Kriya Systems?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Apple has announced the 20 meg drive that plugs into the
disk port. They realize it's very important to get it out ASAP so
they're working real hard on it now. It will use the new hierarchical
file system loaded in RAM, because it will be out before the
new ROMs are available. A consequence of that is it will only
run on 512K or bigger machines. More info should be available
in the fall. Neon is an interesting idea, but good language
systems take a long time to mature and theirs is still in its
very early stages. I think it's not yet a practical environment
for commercial programming, but is interesting for fun
(Franklin Tessler) Andy: Apple
has announced an October shipping date for the 20 Meg drives...
did you mean earlier then that the ROMs would be out after
that. Also, will Switcher 4.0 be an "official" release?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Switcher 4.0 is the official released version. Yes, the
hard disk is currently supposed to come out before the new ROMs, so it
will run the new file system in RAM
(Brad Holt) Andy - Is there any chance us number crunchers will be able to
turn in our VAX's for a MAC with a co-processor soon, and second, what is
the state of Atari and Comm. software compared to the MAC's when new?
(Andy Hertzfeld) I've seen machines on the drawing board that have a socket
for the Motorola math chip; it's also possible to do a HyperDrive-type
math chip product for the current Mac. From what I've seen, both the
Atari and Amiga software is in the same state Mac software was in in
about early 1982; i.e., its got a long way to go.
(Bill Gibson) A simple question. What is the status of MacBASIC and is Doug
Dennman still writing it.
(Andy Hertzfeld) MacBasic is all finished (finally). It was written by
Donn Denmann (not Doug). The only hold-up now is Apple trying to decide
if its worth releasing it, given the fact that MicroSoft Basic has gotten
fairly good and the headaches involved in maintaining and supporting a new
programming environment.
(David Heller) Andy, if i do my own upgrade is apple going to support me
on the ROM upgrade and do you have any idea what the approx cost of the
ROM upgrade will be?
(Andy Hertzfeld) If you upgrade to more than 512K, make sure to keep the
screen at the top of the address space. Apple will try to sell the
ROMs as cheaply as they can. Since the ROMs will cost Apple around 20
dollars, I would expect them to sell for around 60 dollars or so.
(Eric Zocher) Two Q's: 1) Can you reveal any specifics about the contents
of the additional space in the new ROM(s) - will system resources like
Chicago FONT, MDEFs, WDEFs, CDEFs be in silicon? 2) Do you know when &
how info will be available about the new hierarchical file system? Will
software supplement purchasers be getting a new File Manager chapter
of IM? THANKS in advance!
(Andy Hertzfeld) The new ROM isn't frozen yet, so things are subject to
change, but I would expect the Chicago font (but no other fonts),
WDEF 0, MDEF 0, CDEFs for buttons and scrollbars and most of the PACKS
to be in the ROM. Info on the new file system should be available to
developers through the normal channels pretty soon. The new file system
is compatible with the old except for people who follow the FCB list
(the FCB size is different) or read the directory themselves. Most
software will run just fine because the "vRefNum" will mean the working
directory instead of default volume
(Tim Pulling) Will there be an upgrade to replace the internal
drive with a double sided drive? I've heard there might be heat
considerations.
(Andy Hertzfeld) Yes, there will be an upgrade to replace the internal
drive. It will be optionally bundled with the new ROM so you only have
to open the Mac up once. It will be available in the same time frame
as the new ROM
(Christian Doucet) Is there any chances that we see a Color Mac
Before Jan 24 86? And also what about Screen buffer size?
(Andy Hertzfeld) I don't think you'll see a color Mac anytime at all in
1986, really. I'm not sure what you mean about screen buffer size; I
think there's a good chance you'll see a black and white Mac with
a bigger screen and more dots in early 86.
(Doug Quebbeman) Andy, 1st, will the Lisa Smalltalk find its way to the Mac?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Lisa SmallTalk should be available for the Mac, since Dan
Ingalls, the world's leading SmallTalk expert, has been working real hard
on it. I've seen it running on a 512K Mac, but I'm not sure what the
marketting plans are.
(Tom Mackie) Andy, much has been reported - especially on ARPAnet- as to
power supply/overheating problems. Can you comment? And do you indeed run
you Mac with the cover off?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Apple is pretty careful about testing things like that,
but its always possible to get a bad batch of components in and have
it slip through quality control. Before I got my Hyper, I used to run
a Mac without a cover, but that had nothing to do with overheating;
I was diddling around with the hardware about so it was more convenient
to leave the cover off. I did get a bad electric shock once;
I wouldn't recommend it.
(Eric Zocher) I just heard a rumor that a 24-pin Imagewriter II with
2 - 3 times the throughput of the Imagewriter is in the works.
Care to comment?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Yes, it's true, except I'm not sure how many elements are
on the printhead. It is considerably faster and does have much nicer
print quality.
(Vernon Keenan) I'm shopping for C compiler...can you recommend one?
(Andy Hertzfeld) Most people I know use the Consulair C compiler. It does
not generate very tight code, but it is fairly mature and is well
interfaced to the Mac system. Apple has a C compiler that should be
released as part of the MPS development system, but its currently
vaporware.
(Dennis/AltSysop) Latest release of Consulair Mac C generates code about as
good as any of the other native Mac Cs but it doesn't come close to
Workshop C.
(David Jacobs) Will there ever be an Apple Profile that can hook up to
both the Mac and Apple II.
(Andy Hertzfeld) I think the new 20Meg external drive from Apple will be
capable of doing that, since it interfaces through the IWM, which is
common to both Mac and the Apple ][. All it would take is a driver for
ProDos and probably some ProDos -> Mac conversion software that I think
they're already working on. One of the advantages of the recent
re-organization is that things like that should be much more likely to
happen.
(Brad Pettit) Are there any planned updates to MacPascal that will make it
easier to use the toolbox or that will permit more sizable applications.
(Andy Hertzfeld) If you mean the interactive Pascal from Think Technologies,
yes, they are currently working on a "developer's version" that should
be quite practical for writing large applications. It will have the
option of generating native code, while retaining it's unique interactive
flavor. Last March they siad it would be ready in the fall, but
I haven't heard about it recently.
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The full text of this conference is available on Compuserve.
--
Bill Arnett {ucbvax}!tolerant!maddog
Tolerant Systems, Inc. San Jose
408/946-5667