morse@leadsv.UUCP (Terry Morse) (07/24/85)
Does anybody have an opinion on the relative merits of JAZZ versus all the
Microsoft programs: FILE, WORD, MULTIPLAN, CHART ? Being the owner of the
latter, I would like to know if it's worth the money to change over.
I have heard that JAZZ allows multiple windows between applications, so you
can have your chart window up with your spreadsheet window. That beats the
hassle of swapping disks and relaunching a program.
Does JAZZ permit the writing of macros for database management? That's a
read drawback to FILE. I have never used Lotus before, because I vowed
never to use a (blech) PC.
--
Terry Morse (408)743-1487
{ seismo!nsc!cae780 } | { sun!sunncal } leadsv!morsetdn@cmu-cs-spice.ARPA (Thomas Newton) (07/26/85)
If you have a 512K Mac, which you'd need to run JAZZ, you can move back and
forth between FILE, WORD, MULTIPLAN, and CHART by using the Switcher. I'm not
sure how much disk swapping would be involved (I have WORD and a 128K Mac).
Thomas.Newton@cmu-cs-spice.ARPApeirce@lll-crg.ARPA (Michael Peirce) (07/26/85)
> Does anybody have an opinion on the relative merits of JAZZ versus all the > Microsoft programs: FILE, WORD, MULTIPLAN, CHART ? I haven't used Jazz, but the *only* way to get lots of work done with more than one of MicroSoft's programs at a time is with Switcher! It seems to me that with Switcher you really don't don't need an "integrated" package. With Switcher you can pick exactly those applications that YOU want to run together (MultiPlan & Chart, MacTerminal & Word, ...) The Mac already provides you with a fairly consistent user interface (one of the Big plus's on other systems and with switcher you can pop between the different programs with a flick of the wrist. Jazz might be very nice, but I really don't feel the need. -- michael, always
rjd@faron.UUCP (Robert DeBenedictis) (07/30/85)
In article <397@cmu-cs-spice.ARPA> tdn@cmu-cs-spice (Thomas Newton) writes: >If you have a 512K Mac, which you'd need to run JAZZ, you can move back and >forth between FILE, WORD, MULTIPLAN, and CHART by using the Switcher. I'm not >sure how much disk swapping would be involved (I have WORD and a 128K Mac). > > Thomas.Newton@cmu-cs-spice.ARPA You have a good point here. What's all the hoopla about Jazz when the Mac already has the capability to exchange information between programs? Why would anyone want to pay as much as two or three of the good separate programsfor a giant program that does a little bit of everything. I think that many of the benefits of programs like Framework and Symphony, which were successful on the PC, are lost on the Mac. This is because the Mac already has a pretty consistent user interface and already has the ability to cut and paste things between programs. Why would you buy Jazz when you could get a better spreadsheet (Excel), a better database (there are several), a better terminal program ... And you could probably buy most of these for the same price as Jazz. Perhaps many people have not yet tried Switcher .... Am I missing something (besides Hotview)????
al@aurora.UUCP (Al Globus) (07/31/85)
I've used Multiplan and JAZZ and File (a little). I much prefer JAZZ to the Microsoft products for two primary reasons: The user interface of JAZZ is a little nicer in my opinion. Integration is much better with JAZZ. For example, you can put up two windows, one with a spread sheet and another with graphics. Change the spreadsheet and WALA, the graphics change. NOW. Not after fiddling with the Clipboard and shifting back and forth between applications. Putting together complex graphs of changing data should be MUCH faster with JAZZ.
tomczak@h-sc1.UUCP (bill tomczak) (08/01/85)
Summary: I am slowly beginning to understand the phrase "cost effectiveness" as it applies to micros. As far as I'm concerned nobody should pay the $600 Lotus is asking for JAZZ. I was one of those who became carried away by the hoopla regarding JAZZ. Part of my justification was being able to get it through the University consortium for $300 instead of the retail price. My feeling is that it was ALMOST worth it. To anybody out there thinking of buying JAZZ, my recommendation is to either wait for the new-super-duper Microsoft enhancements coming out this fall or put together your own combination of packages that do the same set of things (database, wordprocessing, etc...). I miss the capabilities of a good relational database. In fact I'm seriously considering doing that myself and chalking up my purchase of JAZZ to a learning experience. I won't say I've been burned, because the programs are well done. But think hard before buying JAZZ. Bill Tomczak (No nifty .sig but give me time...)
chuqui@nsc.UUCP (Chuq Von Rospach) (08/03/85)
In article <319@faron.UUCP> rjd@faron.UUCP (Robert DeBenedictis) writes: >In article <397@cmu-cs-spice.ARPA> tdn@cmu-cs-spice (Thomas Newton) writes: >>If you have a 512K Mac, which you'd need to run JAZZ, you can move back and >>forth between FILE, WORD, MULTIPLAN, and CHART by using the Switcher. I'm not >>sure how much disk swapping would be involved (I have WORD and a 128K Mac). >> >> Thomas.Newton@cmu-cs-spice.ARPA >You have a good point here. What's all the hoopla about Jazz when the Mac >already has the capability to exchange information between programs? > >Why would anyone want to pay as much as two or three of the good separate >programsfor a giant program that does a little bit of everything. I think >that many of the benefits of programs like Framework and Symphony, which >were successful on the PC, are lost on the Mac. This is because the Mac >already has a pretty consistent user interface and already has the ability >to cut and paste things between programs. One BIG advantage of Jazz/Excel/Ensemble over a bunch of integrated programs under Switcher is that changes made in one section of the program like the spreadsheet can be propogated in real-time to the graphing functions, or to the database, or to the report you're writing. With switcher, you'd have to either save it to disk, switch, and load, or save it to the clipboard and carry it across. This can't be done in real time, but still requires you do manually carry data through. Jazz allows you to update something in one place and simply have it squirt automatically into the other things it needs to be in. Switcher doesn't really integrate a bunch of applications, it simply removes most of the context switch time. The advantage of switcher is that it lets you build up an 'integrated' program of your favorite applications instead of having to decide on the best tradeoffs for your stuff (for me, Ensemble looks to be a better deal than Jazz because my work is data oriented, but for a spreadsheet hacker jazz looks to be significantly better, for example). IT all depends upon work habits. I've worked with both RamDisk's and with Switcher, and found that neither really help the way I use the machine. Others will swear by either, or both... Fortunately, the Mac is flexible that it can be used in the way that the USER finds most productive, rather than the programmer or marketing types. THAT is the big advantage of all of this, and something most/all other systems seem to be missing. chuq -- :From the carousel of the autumn carnival: Chuq Von Rospach {cbosgd,fortune,hplabs,ihnp4,seismo}!nsc!chuqui nsc!chuqui@decwrl.ARPA Your fifteen minutes are up. Please step aside!