gus@Shasta.ARPA (01/12/86)
There seems to be a large number of messages on the net that sound like either, "I can't get xxx to work with HFS" or "How do I back up xxx?" There is a simple procedure for dealing with each of these problems. HOW TO GET A PROGRAM TO WORK WITH HFS 1) Buy the program 2) Send in your registration card 3) Wait till around February for an update 4) If an update does not come, and the program still does not work, then call the company. Remember that a lot of companies may be holding off until Apple announces new products to make sure that they did not make any dumb mistakes. Many people are still wondering why the Hard Disk 20 was released with the 5.0 finder early in the first place instead of waiting until now with the rest of the products, especially since people are only now starting to get their HD 20's. HOW TO BACK UP ANY PIECE OF SOFTWARE 1) Go to your local dealer and check out the software you are interested in. 2) IF the software is more than 1 month old THEN a) Buy the program b) Buy the current release of COPY II Mac. ELSE a) Buy the program b) Note the current release of COPY II Mac but don't buy it unless you already know that your program is already copyable with it. c) Wait 2 weeks to 1 month d) Check the new release of COPY II Mac. e) If the release is the same as the previous one, go back to step b. f) Buy the current release of Copy II Mac. 3) Use Copy II Mac to backup the program that you just bought. Copy II Mac by Central Point Software is far and away be best supported program available for the Mac, if you count the number of released versions as a measure of support. I cannot see why software companies insist on pouring thousands of dollars into copy protection which from past experience has lasted less than a month at worst. Jazz, perhaps the most sophisticated protection system known to date lasted less than 2 weeks. Excel relied on its P-Code interpreter in order to be un-copyable for at most 1 month. Copy II Mac is available at my local dealer for $22.95 (ComputerWare, Palo Alto, CA) and is certainly worth every penny I paid for it. Unlike on the IBM PC, no reliable method has been found to write a mark on a Mac disk that can be READ but not WRITTEN by the Mac's IWM. Physically damaging the media a-la prolock would require that the disk be left un-write-protected. Anyone serious about keeping their valuable software intact will see how unacceptable this would be. (You DO write-protect all of your master disks, don't you?)
guest@ccivax.UUCP (What's in a name ?) (01/18/86)
> unacceptable this would be. (You DO write-protect all of your master disks, > don't you?) I was just wondering... An article on the net several months ago hinted that write-protecting a disk (with the tab in the upper left corner) didn't REALLY protect the disk; that it was up to the software to ask the OS if the disk was locked; that if the s/w didn't ask, the disk could be written to whether or not it was locked. DOES ANYONE IN NETLAND KNOW IF THIS IS TRUE????? Sam Mantel -- Roch, NY
borton@sdcc3.UUCP (Chris Borton) (01/19/86)
In article <348@ccivax.UUCP> guest@ccivax.UUCP (What's in a name ?) writes: >I was just wondering... An article on the net several months ago hinted that >write-protecting a disk (with the tab in the upper left corner) didn't REALLY >protect the disk; that it was up to the software to ask the OS if the disk >was locked; that if the s/w didn't ask, the disk could be written to whether >or not it was locked. DOES ANYONE IN NETLAND KNOW IF THIS IS TRUE????? > > >Sam Mantel -- Roch, NY I believe this is true since I had a nasty experience with ResEdit (0.5 I think) last spring. I had the disk locked, and was trying to Paste a resource into another file. ResEdit gave a spurious error, not hinting at disk-lock being the problem at all, and informed me that it couldn't save the file. However, every time I tried, it would update the Last Modified: date/time for that file. One that 'it couldn't save' and was on a locked disk. This indicates to me that disk-locking doesn't have any hardware protection at all. Anyone have a more technical explanation? --Chris --------------- Chris Borton, UC San Diego Undergraduate CS Micro Consultant, UCSD borton@ucsd.ARPA or ...!{ucbvax,decvax,noscvax,ihnp4,bang}!sdcsvax!borton
korn@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU (Peter "Arrgh" Korn) (01/20/86)
Has to be, as finder 1.1g would allow you to edit filenames and the
finder "info" stuff, even though the disk was "write protected". Finder
4.5 doesn't allow this though...
-----
Peter Korn korn@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU {dual,dscvax,sdcsvax}!ucbvax!korngus@Shasta.ARPA (01/21/86)
> > unacceptable this would be. (You DO write-protect all of your master disks, > > don't you?) > > I was just wondering... An article on the net several months ago hinted that > write-protecting a disk (with the tab in the upper left corner) didn't REALLY > protect the disk; that it was up to the software to ask the OS if the disk > was locked; that if the s/w didn't ask, the disk could be written to whether > or not it was locked. DOES ANYONE IN NETLAND KNOW IF THIS IS TRUE????? > > > Sam Mantel -- Roch, NY ...And an article from Apple a few days later said that indeed, the disk IS write-protected in hardware as well as software.
wrs@wb1.cs.cmu.edu (Walter Smith) (01/22/86)
In article <348@ccivax.UUCP>, guest@ccivax.UUCP (What's in a name ?) writes: > I was just wondering... An article on the net several months ago hinted that > write-protecting a disk (with the tab in the upper left corner) didn't REALLY > protect the disk; that it was up to the software to ask the OS if the disk > was locked; that if the s/w didn't ask, the disk could be written to whether > or not it was locked. DOES ANYONE IN NETLAND KNOW IF THIS IS TRUE????? > > > Sam Mantel -- Roch, NY According to the Hardware Manual, the IWM has a status bit indicating that the disk is locked. It says to be sure to check this bit before writing to the disk. I would think this was done at the disk driver level, but there seem to be cases of applications writing to locked disks, so... -- Walter Smith, CS undergraduate, Carnegie-Mellon University uucp: ...!seismo!cmu-cs-k!wrs arpa: wrs@cmu-cs-k.ARPA usps: 5141 Forbes Ave.; Pittsburgh, PA 15213
hammen@gumby.UUCP (Robert Hammen) (01/24/86)
In article <1667@Shasta.ARPA>, gus@Shasta.ARPA writes: > > > unacceptable this would be. (You DO write-protect all of your master disks, > > > don't you?) > > > > I was just wondering... An article on the net several months ago hinted that > > write-protecting a disk (with the tab in the upper left corner) didn't REALLY > > protect the disk; that it was up to the software to ask the OS if the disk > > was locked; that if the s/w didn't ask, the disk could be written to whether > > or not it was locked. DOES ANYONE IN NETLAND KNOW IF THIS IS TRUE????? > > > > > > Sam Mantel -- Roch, NY > > ...And an article from Apple a few days later said that indeed, the disk IS > write-protected in hardware as well as software. The way the protection works is if a sensor sees the little red light shine through the hole of a locked disk, nothing gets written to the disk. However, I've been told that it is possible to instruct the IWM to turn off the light, thereby making the disk writeable.... Robert J. Hammen Manta Software Corp. U of Wisc. CS Dept. hammen@gumby.uucp
mrgofor@mmm.UUCP (Michael Ross) (01/27/86)
In article <45@gumby.UUCP> hammen@gumby.UUCP writes: > >The way the protection works is if a sensor sees the little red light shine >through the hole of a locked disk, nothing gets written to the disk. >However, I've been told that it is possible to instruct the IWM to turn off >the light, thereby making the disk writeable.... > Robert J. Hammen > Manta Software Corp. > U of Wisc. CS Dept. > hammen@gumby.uucp Then how come my Sony disks work? The write-protect mechanism on those diskettes doesn't include a hole going through the diskette - there is a small tab that can be moved back and forth, but you can't see through the diskette in either mode. --MKR
hammen@puff.UUCP (Zaphod Beeblebrox) (01/30/86)
In article <425@mmm.UUCP>, mrgofor@mmm.UUCP (Michael Ross) writes: > In article <45@gumby.UUCP> hammen@gumby.UUCP writes: > > > >The way the protection works is if a sensor sees the little red light shine > >through the hole of a locked disk, nothing gets written to the disk. > >However, I've been told that it is possible to instruct the IWM to turn off > >the light, thereby making the disk writeable.... > > Robert J. Hammen > > Manta Software Corp. > > U of Wisc. CS Dept. > > hammen@gumby.uucp > > Then how come my Sony disks work? The write-protect mechanism on those > diskettes doesn't include a hole going through the diskette - there is a > small tab that can be moved back and forth, but you can't see through the > diskette in either mode. > > --MKR No, you don't seem to understand. The tab that you slide back & forth IS the hole that I'm referring to. (I never said the hole was in the actual media). When the tab is moved so that you can see through the CASE of the microdisk, then the disk is locked. Robert J. Hammen
tim@k.cs.cmu.edu.UUCP (02/01/86)
Real hackers look before they talk. In computers, it's a big mistake to
confuse assumptions with reality.
A quick glance at the position of the write-protect tab inside the disk
drive (and you don't have to take off the case for this) shows a little
spring-driven metal tab, and no LED. Therefore, all this stuff about
turning off the LED is the sheerest fabrication. The mechanism is obviously
mechanical, not optical.
-=-
Tim Maroney, Electronic Village Idiot, Centram Systems West, Berkeley
uucp: {sun,lll-crg,well,dual,ptsfa,frog,decvax}!hoptoad!tim
CompuServe: 74176,1360 | Do not remove this quip under penalty of law.gcc@ssc-vax.UUCP (Greg C Croasdill) (02/03/86)
> > >The way the protection works is if a sensor sees the little red light shine > > >through the hole of a locked disk, nothing gets written to the disk. > > >However, I've been told that it is possible to instruct the IWM to turn off > > >the light, thereby making the disk writeable.... > > > Robert J. Hammen > > > Manta Software Corp. > > > U of Wisc. CS Dept. > > > hammen@gumby.uucp > > > > Then how come my Sony disks work? The write-protect mechanism on those > > diskettes doesn't include a hole going through the diskette - there is a > > small tab that can be moved back and forth, but you can't see through the > > diskette in either mode. > > > > --MKR > No, you don't seem to understand. The tab that you slide back & forth IS > the hole that I'm referring to. (I never said the hole was in the actual > media). When the tab is moved so that you can see through the CASE of the > microdisk, then the disk is locked. > > Robert J. Hammen *** REPLACE THIS LINE WITH YOUR MESSAGE *** On the HP 3.5" disk there is no hole. (period) There is a small clip in the correct place for the hole, which you can break off and "protect" your disks, but no light can get through this area in any case. Here at Boeing, this is the type of disk stocked, are we screwed ? Can we not protect our data? Let's here some real answers (Apple). Thanks in advance. Greg C (uw-beaver|fluke)!ssc-vax!gcc disclaimer: I am not speaking for the Boeing company, only as an interested party, with alot of valuable data on perhaps vulnerable diskettes. quote of the day: 'A woman stepped forward and asked, "What is the strangest day?" "Tuesday", the Master explained.' -from _The Profit_ by Kehlog Albran
mrgofor@mmm.UUCP (Michael Ross) (02/05/86)
In article <597@puff.UUCP> hammen@puff.UUCP (Zaphod Beeblebrox) writes: >In article <425@mmm.UUCP>, mrgofor@mmm.UUCP (Michael Ross) writes: >> In article <45@gumby.UUCP> hammen@gumby.UUCP writes: >> > >> >The way the protection works is if a sensor sees the little red light shine >> >through the hole of a locked disk, nothing gets written to the disk. >> >However, I've been told that it is possible to instruct the IWM to turn off >> >the light, thereby making the disk writeable.... >> > Robert J. Hammen >> > Manta Software Corp. >> > U of Wisc. CS Dept. >> > hammen@gumby.uucp >> >> Then how come my Sony disks work? The write-protect mechanism on those >> diskettes doesn't include a hole going through the diskette - there is a >> small tab that can be moved back and forth, but you can't see through the >> diskette in either mode. >> >> --MKR > No, you don't seem to understand. The tab that you slide back & forth IS > the hole that I'm referring to. (I never said the hole was in the actual > media). When the tab is moved so that you can see through the CASE of the > microdisk, then the disk is locked. > > Robert J. Hammen No, you don't seem to understand. The CASE does NOT have a hole in it. No matter where the tab is, you cannot see through the case. I know what you mean about the holes, but my point was that I think it must be mechanical rather than optical in nature because of the fact that some (not all) of my Sony diskettes do not have a hole all the way through. There is an easy way to check - I could just look at the damned drive and find out, but I'm too lazy. Besides, ungrounded speculation is fun. --MKR
espen@well.UUCP (Peter Espen) (02/11/86)
In article <454@mmm.UUCP>, mrgofor@mmm.UUCP (Michael Ross) writes: > In article <597@puff.UUCP> hammen@puff.UUCP (Zaphod Beeblebrox) writes: > >In article <425@mmm.UUCP>, mrgofor@mmm.UUCP (Michael Ross) writes: > >> In article <45@gumby.UUCP> hammen@gumby.UUCP writes: > >> > > >> >The way the protection works is if a sensor sees the little red light shine > >> >through the hole of a locked disk, nothing gets written to the disk. > >> >However, I've been told that it is possible to instruct the IWM to turn off > >> >the light, thereby making the disk writeable.... > >> > Robert J. Hammen > >> > Manta Software Corp. > >> > U of Wisc. CS Dept. > >> > hammen@gumby.uucp > >> > >> Then how come my Sony disks work? The write-protect mechanism on those > >> diskettes doesn't include a hole going through the diskette - there is a > >> small tab that can be moved back and forth, but you can't see through the > >> diskette in either mode. > >> > >> --MKR > > No, you don't seem to understand. The tab that you slide back & forth IS > > the hole that I'm referring to. (I never said the hole was in the actual > > media). When the tab is moved so that you can see through the CASE of the > > microdisk, then the disk is locked. > > > > Robert J. Hammen > > No, you don't seem to understand. The CASE does NOT have a hole > in it. No matter where the tab is, you cannot see through the case. I know > what you mean about the holes, but my point was that I think it must be > mechanical rather than optical in nature because of the fact that some > (not all) of my Sony diskettes do not have a hole all the way through. > There is an easy way to check - I could just look at the damned drive > and find out, but I'm too lazy. Besides, ungrounded speculation is fun. > > --MKR My reality frame of reference states that the write-protection scheme on the Mac/Sony 3.5" Single-sided drives is indeed mechanical, not optical like on many of the older 5.25" and 8" drives that we all know and don't miss. Peter Espen