henry@rochester.UUCP (11/28/84)
From: Henry.Kautz
All these fully-justified complaints about Macterminal's interpretation
of various keys (eg difficulty of typing ~, lack of linefeed, lack of
function keys w/o using mouse, etc) would be easily solved if the
program had an option to read in a file re-binding the keys to
arbitrary sequences of characters. But, once again Apple is
"protecting" the consumer from his/herself ...... let's hope someone
writing software for the Mac discovers that "use friendly" doesn't mean
"inflexible"....
---- Henry Kautz
:uucp: {seismo|allegra}!rochester!henry
:arpa: henry@rochester
--
---- Henry Kautz
:uucp: {seismo|allegra}!rochester!henry
:arpa: henry@rochesterjimb@amd.UUCP (Jim Budler) (11/29/84)
Newsgroups: net.micro.mac Subject: Re: macterminal Summary: Expires: References: <> Sender: Reply-To: jimb@amd.UUCP (Jim Budler) Followup-To: Distribution: Organization: AMD, Santa Clara, CA Keywords: In article <> henry@rochester.UUCP writes: >All these fully-justified complaints about Macterminal's interpretation >of various keys (eg difficulty of typing ~, lack of linefeed, lack of >function keys w/o using mouse, etc) would be easily solved if the >program had an option to read in a file re-binding the keys to >arbitrary sequences of characters. But, once again Apple is >"protecting" the consumer from his/herself ...... let's hope someone >writing software for the Mac discovers that "use friendly" doesn't mean >"inflexible".... And why not ask for automatic terminal reconfiguration capability xmodem AND kermit, macros, and every other possible thing anyone could want in a terminal program. It barely fits in a 128K mac now. 1. Reconfiguration of keys takes a couple of minutes with Fedit. The tables are in block 5, 6, and 7. Each key has sixteen combinations of option, shift, caps lock. The table is ordered. Almost all the option keys are unused. Have fun. 2. Apple HAS to protect the consumer, they are trying to sell to any schmuck who can walk into a store. They already know that someone else will bring out a more versatile version of any software they provide. They barely got MacTerminal out as it is now. You wanted to wait another 6 months? -- Jim Budler Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (408) 982-6547 UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amd!jimb Compuserve: 72415,1200 The Source: STW265
rsw@nvuxb.UUCP (R.WOLFF) (01/08/85)
Does MacTerminal have a "log to printer" feature? Can text appearing on the screen be printed on the imagewriter as it is received? R. S. Wolff (nvuxb!rsw) Bell Communications Research, Holmdel NJ 201 949-6872
harrow@exodus.DEC (06/13/85)
I'm kind of saddened by the constant "beating" on MacTerminal. I have
no connection with it, and also have problems with several aspects of the
program, but hey, folks, it was the **FIRST**, and does an excellent job
of emulating the VT100.
There may be some problems, but, developers: IT WAS A GOOD JOB!
Jeff
Work address:
ARPAnet: HARROW%EXODUS.DEC@decwrl.ARPA
Usenet: {allegra,Shasta,decvax}!decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-exodus!harrow
Easynet: EXODUS::HARROW
Telephone: (617)858-3134
USPS: Digital Equipment Corp.
Mail stop: TWO/E92
1925 Andover St.
Tewksbury, MA 01876jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) (06/14/85)
In article <2661@decwrl.UUCP> harrow@exodus.DEC (Jeff Harrow NCSE TWO/E92 DTN=247-3134) writes: >I'm kind of saddened by the constant "beating" on MacTerminal. I have >... >program, but hey, folks, it was the **FIRST**, and does an excellent job > >There may be some problems, but, developers: IT WAS A GOOD JOB! Here, here! I've been using it for months, and with macput, macget, macsend and xbin, it is the terminal program of CHOICE when communicating with my Usenet host. The kermit is nice, and perhaps better, but then I have to download the whole file and BinHex it. -- Jim Budler Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (408) 749-5806 UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amdcad!jimb Compuserve: 72415,1200 "... Don't sue me, I'm just the piano player!...."
rjd@linus.UUCP (Robert DeBenedictis) (06/17/85)
In article <2661@decwrl.UUCP> harrow@exodus.DEC writes: >I'm kind of saddened by the constant "beating" on MacTerminal.... >There may be some problems, but, developers: IT WAS A GOOD JOB! > >Jeff Here Here! I have tried most of the popular programs (Macterminal, RedRider, Freeterm, Kermit, and others but not Versaterm) and I find MacT to be one of the nicest. I like the way it handles the terminal "window." You can click and drag on it to select a piece of text for saving or printing, and it has normal scroll bars so you can easily refer back to old stuff if you want. MacT advantages: Works cleanly and logically. Never loses chars when you interupt it with a command. Has built in phone functions. Saves scrolled text an "infinite screen". Has "print selection" command for easy printing of text. Saves comm. parameters and phone numbers in "documents" so its easy to access different remote machines. Does _excellent_ vt-100 emulation including bold, reverse, 132-col., status lights, etc. Small problems (v1.1 -- not the latest): It's hard to convince it to receive files onto other disks. There is a small but sometimes annoying bug which causes the disk to run at random times. It doesn't provide any way to store command procedures like RedRider (a feature of questionable importance). Doesn't handle Binary transfers (again, I'm speaking of v1.1). Overall I think Macterminal has a lot to offer. If it handled Binary transfers, I'd probably never use anything else
arndt@ttds.UUCP (Arndt Jonasson) (06/18/85)
In article <1639@amdcad.UUCP> jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) writes: > >I've been using [MacTerminal] for months, and with macput, macget, macsend >and xbin, it is the terminal program of CHOICE when communicating with my >Usenet host. The kermit is nice, and perhaps better, but then I have to >download the whole file and BinHex it. I haven't learned how to use macput, macget etc., so for file transfers I use the new Columbia Kermit. Works wonderfully, and is almost vt100 compatible as well. Only reason I don't use kermit when reading news etc. on a remote host is that the national keys are all wrong. My copy of MacTerminal has its keys mapped to accomodate for the Swedish national characters, and I have only two complaints about MacTerminal: 1) When logging text, it often complains: "the disk is full. no more text will be saved", when there are more than 300 k left on the hard disk! 2) If I am connected to a remote host and choose the menu alternative for using XON/XOFF protocol, MacTerminal invariably shuts down the modem line. General complaints about all terminal emulators except MacTerminal: there is no way to remap national characters on the keyboard. Arndt Jonasson, ZYX Research, Stockholm uucp: {decvax, philabs}!mcvax!enea!ttds!arndt
barnett@ut-sally.UUCP (Lewis Barnett) (06/18/85)
> > MacT advantages: Works cleanly and logically... > Saves comm. parameters and phone numbers in "documents" so its > easy to access different remote machines. > I beg to differ! I've used both MacTerminal and Versaterm pretty extensively, and I find VersaTerm's method for dealing with multiple hosts (a menu with mnemonics for all the phone numbers you dial) FAR superior to MacT's way of doing things. Face it, it's a real pain to close the current document, then wait while the document for the next machine you want to dial up gets loaded and cranked up... I think that this is one case where Apple's predelection for the desktop idiom got in their way. (I am in no way associated with Apple or Lonnie Abelbeck, except that I chose Lonnie's product over Apple's...) Lewis Barnett,CS Dept, Painter Hall 3.28, Univ. of Texas, Austin, TX 78712 -- barnett@ut-sally.ARPA, barnett@ut-sally.UUCP, {ihnp4,harvard,seismo,gatech,ctvax}!ut-sally!barnett
jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) (06/19/85)
In article <2125@ut-sally.UUCP> barnett@ut-sally.UUCP (Lewis Barnett) writes: >> >> MacT advantages: Works cleanly and logically... >> Saves comm. parameters and phone numbers in "documents" so its >> easy to access different remote machines. >... >I beg to differ! I've used both MacTerminal and Versaterm pretty >extensively, and I find VersaTerm's method for dealing with multiple >hosts (a menu with mnemonics for all the phone numbers you dial) I would agree with you if it weren't for the fact that Apple's method provides much more than phone number storage. In addition to the phone number you get terminal configuration. I work with seven different hosts, and only 3 of those use the same configuration. -- Jim Budler Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (408) 749-5806 UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amdcad!jimb Compuserve: 72415,1200 "... Don't sue me, I'm just the piano player!...."
smh@rduxb.UUCP (henning) (06/20/85)
> >I beg to differ! I've used both MacTerminal and Versaterm pretty > >extensively, and I find VersaTerm's method for dealing with multiple > >hosts (a menu with mnemonics for all the phone numbers you dial) > > I would agree with you if it weren't for the fact that Apple's method > provides much more than phone number storage. In addition to the > phone number you get terminal configuration. I work with seven > different hosts, and only 3 of those use the same configuration. **** **** From the keys of Steve Henning, AT&T Bell Labs, Reading, PA rduxb!smh Versaterm stores all the configurations for each phone number. They are called automatically when you select the phone number. I routinely use Versaterm to contact 7 different mainframes using DG, TEK4014, VT100, and HP emulation on 4 different configurations by just selecting a phone number. Also, Versaterm is UNIX friendly with delete, and other useful keys handy. Disclaimer: I am a co-worker of Lonny's but am not connected with Versaterm.
barnett@ut-sally.UUCP (Lewis Barnett) (06/20/85)
> In article <2125@ut-sally.UUCP> barnett@ut-sally.UUCP (Lewis Barnett) writes: > >> > >> [MacT] Saves comm. parameters and phone numbers in "documents" so its > >> easy to access different remote machines. > >... > >I beg to differ! I've used both MacTerminal and Versaterm pretty > >extensively, and I find VersaTerm's method for dealing with multiple > >hosts (a menu with mnemonics for all the phone numbers you dial) > > I would agree with you if it weren't for the fact that Apple's method > provides much more than phone number storage. In addition to the > phone number you get terminal configuration. I work with seven > different hosts, and only 3 of those use the same configuration. > -- > Jim Budler > Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. > (408) 749-5806 > UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amdcad!jimb > Compuserve: 72415,1200 > Well, the same is true of Versaterm; once you've entered the phone number, mnemonic code, and proper settings, you select "save settings," which preserves the association between the number and the settings across invocations. I believe the functionality is identical to MacT's. Lewis Barnett,CS Dept, Painter Hall 3.28, Univ. of Texas, Austin, TX 78712 -- barnett@ut-sally.ARPA, barnett@ut-sally.UUCP, {ihnp4,harvard,seismo,gatech,ctvax}!ut-sally!barnett
jwp@utah-cs.UUCP (John W Peterson) (06/20/85)
VersaTerm stores both the phone number AND the configuration under each of the "Hosts" in the menu. Thus, if you select a different host that was configured with a different baud rate, the baud rate is changed automaticly.
jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) (07/22/85)
In article <20800018@smu> mike@smu writes: > >I can't believe that I am reading comments praising MacTerminal. >Maybe I got the wrong version, like maybe the special broken version. >Is version 1.1 not the most recent? Anyway, whatever I have crashes >with disturbing frequency (just starts beeping and beeping and >beeping...) and has a VERY hard time keeping track of its >configuration files. There seems to be about a 50% chance of a config >file working; otherwise MacTerminal thinks that "the document has been >damaged". ... Yes, I have praised MacTerminal. I've been using it as my primary terminal program since last November. I dimly remember having some of those type of problems back when I was running a single drive with nearly no extra space on the disk. The problems went away when I removed all fonts except the required system fonts. By the way, WHAT are all these people using macput and xbin with, if not MacTerminal? -- Jim Budler Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (408) 749-5806 UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amdcad!jimb Compuserve: 72415,1200 "... Don't sue me, I'm just the piano player!...."
harold@ubvax.UUCP (Harold Cook) (07/23/85)
In article <2083@amdcad.UUCP> jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) writes: >In article <20800018@smu> mike@smu writes: >> >>I can't believe that I am reading comments praising MacTerminal. >>Maybe I got the wrong version, like maybe the special broken version. >> ...(text deleted)... > >Yes, I have praised MacTerminal. I've been using it as my primary >terminal program since last November. I dimly remember having some of > ...(text deleted)... > >By the way, WHAT are all these people using macput and xbin with, if not >MacTerminal? >-- > Jim Budler > Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. I too have been using MacTerminal for several months now. I am very pleased with it, and unlike mike@smu, I have never had any problems with it. I am running dual disks with 512k. My method is to boot from the macterminal disk which has a complete system, MacTerminal and all of the binhex, packit utilities on it. On the second disk, I only have MacTerminal documents for each of the systems/setups I need. I find this method very nice as it gives me all of the tools I need and alot of disk space to download/upload with. (I have no affiliation with Apple other than the fact I use their products) Harold E. Cook US Mail: Ungermann-Bass Inc. 2560 Mission College Blvd. Santa Clara Ca 95050 AT&T : (408)496-0111 UUCP : amd!cae780!ubvax!harold or : { decvax | ucbvax }!sun!megatest!ubvax!harold -- Harold E. Cook US Mail: Ungermann-Bass Inc. 2560 Mission College Blvd. Santa Clara Ca 95050 AT&T : (408)496-0111 UUCP : amd!cae780!ubvax!harold or { decvax | ucbvax }!sun!megatest!ubvax!harold
howard@amdahl.UUCP (Howard C. Simonson) (07/26/85)
In article <2083@amdcad.UUCP> jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) writes: > >Yes, I have praised MacTerminal. I've been using it as my primary >terminal program since last November. I dimly remember having some of >those type of problems back when I was running a single drive with nearly >no extra space on the disk. The problems went away when I removed all >fonts except the required system fonts. > >By the way, WHAT are all these people using macput and xbin with, if not >MacTerminal? >-- > Jim Budler... That's easy Jim, Versaterm. I have tried MacTerminal, Red Ryder ( gack ) MockTerminal, and the VT52 DA. For my money ( $99 of it ) Versaterm is the best around. The vt100 support is excellent, the Tektronix 4014 support is good ( I use it on occasion but expect I'll probably be using it more soon ), and I haven't found the need to use the DG D200 terminal support. The mouse understands vi, emacs, and standard vt100 arrows. ( I can actually use the mouse to move my man in rogue! ) It can print the stream as it receives it from the host ( I love this feature ), it does MacXmodem, Text Xmodem, Binary Xmodem and Kermit as menu selections. It has a really neat copy paste function so reentering a long command is a one menu-item choice, and it has about four pages worth of window so you can scroll back and see/select text. This is by far NOT all this program can do. If you can get a demo, do. On the whole, I'm more than happy with this Mac Product. Lonnie, ya done good. BTW, I have no affiliation with the dudes that made and market Versaterm except that I applaud them for a job well done. Also, I bow my head in observance to the organizations whose trademarks I may have used. ( Is all this really necc.? ) -- Time for a new catchy phrase in my Howard C. Simonson .signature, now if I could only ...{dragon,hplabs,ihnp4,nsc}!amdahl!howard think of one... [ Opinion? What opinion. I think you have the wrong guy... ]
tdn@cmu-cs-spice.ARPA (Thomas Newton) (07/26/85)
MacTerminal does have the problem that it likes to buzz the disk every few
seconds, but I haven't had it crash on me as long as I take care to close the
terminal document and quit from the program properly. It also is the only
terminal program I've used out of:
MacTerminal
Beta Versaterm (the one posted to the net a LONG time ago;
I don't know about the current version)
Red Ryder C.06 (also a beta test version; the latest version of RR)
C-Kermit version 4C (really a Kermit with an attached terminal emulator)
that does VT100 emulation well enough that the screen doesn't get messed up
when running Unix (Gosling) Emacs. Red Ryder C.06 seems to work in VT52
emulation mode, but VT52s are very dumb terminals (no delete line command!
at least that's what I surmise when Emacs rewrites the whole screen. . .)
The version I'm running is also somewhat hacked: I changed the built-in
Monaco font to trade one dot of spacing between lines for more readable
lower-case letters, and put resources into my MacTerminal documents to make
the OPTION key act as a CTRL key. I wish Apple had put the information on
keyboard remapping into the MacTerminal manual, but at least they posted it
to net.micro.mac once or twice.
What I'd really like to have is a terminal program that emulates a Concept
with the -LNZ modifications. CLNZs have loadable dictionaries, among other
neat features, and our version of Gosling Emacs knows how to take advantage
of them. It makes a 1200 baud terminal seem more like a 4800 baud terminal.
Oh well, one can always dream.
-- Thomas Newton
Thomas.Newton@cmu-cs-spice.ARPAjimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) (07/26/85)
In article <1842@amdahl.UUCP> howard@amdahl.UUCP (Howard C. Simonson) writes: >In article <2083@amdcad.UUCP> jimb@amdcad.UUCP (Jim Budler) writes: >> >>Yes, I have praised MacTerminal. I've been using it as my primary >>terminal program since last November. ... >>... >>By the way, WHAT are all these people using macput and xbin with, if not >>MacTerminal? >>-- >> Jim Budler... > >That's easy Jim, Versaterm. I have tried MacTerminal, Red Ryder ( gack ) >MockTerminal, and the VT52 DA. For my money ( $99 of it ) Versaterm is >the best around. The vt100 support is excellent, the Tektronix 4014 >... My apologies to Versaterm, if they are necessary. I stand by my praise of MacTerminal. When I BOUGHT it it was the best. I am very happy with it, although some of the extra features you mentioned available on the release version are making my mouth water, I'm afraid, not an additional $99 worth. If I was buying new I'm sure I would take all this into consideration. (Of course if I was buying new, I probably wouldn't know all this!). $99 is an excellent price/performance for MacTerminal and (per you) a better one for Versaterm. But I've already spent my budget for a terminal program. And it works better than my old Pterm and Ascii Express did on the Apple][ I used for 4 years. -- Jim Budler Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (408) 749-5806 UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amdcad!jimb Compuserve: 72415,1200 "... Don't sue me, I'm just the piano player!...."
ccrms@ucdavis.UUCP (Michael Shulman) (07/28/85)
[various discussions about what terminal program is best...] For my money, the current release of MacKermit is the best terminal program. Ok, so it doesn't scroll back the screen, etc, but the vt102 emulation is better in vi (unix) than the vt100. Remember, a vt102 supports line and character insertions and deletions. And we're trying to keep the kermit protocol as a standard. Besides, MacKermit is free! (far less than the $99 for VersaTerm and MacTerm!)
david@ecrhub.UUCP (David M. Haynes) (07/29/85)
> That's easy Jim, Versaterm. I have tried MacTerminal, Red Ryder ( gack ) > MockTerminal, and the VT52 DA. For my money ( $99 of it ) Versaterm is > the best around. The vt100 support is excellent, the Tektronix 4014 > support is good ( I use it on occasion but expect I'll probably be using > it more soon ),... I too have used versaterm and find it to be the best. Two things still bother me tho... 1) The 4014 emulator does not undestand the text (ascii) from plot(3) I'm not the only one who had this problem. 2) When I set vt100 mode I want vt100 mode (even if garbage comes down the line looking like 4014 code. Right now the terminal emulator thinks I've started a 4014 job and switches. Damn annoying for us who use modems and have (slighlty) noisy lines. Otherwise, I totally agree. Versaterm is one of the best! -- -------------------------------------------------------------------------- David M. Haynes Exegetics Inc. ..!utzoo!ecrhub!david "I am my own employer, so I guess my opinions are my own and that of my company."
tmb@talcott.UUCP (Thomas M. Breuel) (08/04/85)
I have been using versaterm on a MacIntosh, and it looks like a nice terminal emulator. It crashes instantly when run on a MacXL (I guess it's not written carefully...). Does anyone know whether the latest versions fix that problem? Thomas.
darin@ut-dillo.UUCP (04/20/86)
<> I know that this has come up before, but: I am new to the world of creating termcap entries. I have the termcap entry for MacTerminal that was posted to the net a while ago, but it does not use the insert/delete character codes that MacTerminal has (is this beyond the ANSI standard based on the VT100?) and there does not seem to be enough padding; my screen is often trashed. After using the MacTerminal termcap for a while, I switched back to the vanilla vt100 termcap and I am still having these same two problems! Does anyone out there have a good termcap for MacTerminal, or the skills and desire to make a good one? -- Darin Adler ...!ut-sally!ut-ngp!ut-dillo!darin
baron@runx.OZ (Jason Haines) (04/29/86)
To Darin Adler:
I hope this helps - I use it with Versaterm, but I can't see why it
wouldn't work with MacTerminal.
--------------------------(Cut Here)----------------------------
# Macintosh/VersaTerm termcap with insert/delete character
d0|vt100|mac-am|versaterm:\
:cr=^M:do=^J:nl=^J:bl=^G:co#80:li#24:cl=50\E[;H\E[2J:\
:le=^H:bs:am:cm=5\E[%i%d;%dH:nd=2\E[C:up=2\E[A:\
:ce=3\E[K:cd=50\E[J:so=\E[7m:se=\E[m:us=\E[4m:ue=\E[m:\
:md=\E[1m:mr=\E[7m:mb=\E[5m:me=\E[m:is=\E[1;24r\E[24;1H:\
:rs=\E>\E[?3l\E[?4l\E[?5l\E[?7h\E[?8h:\
:ks=\E=\E[?1h:ke=\E>\E[?1l:\
:ku=\EOA:kd=\EOB:kr=\EOC:kl=\EOD:kb=^H:\
:ho=\E[H:k1=\EOP:k2=\EOQ:k3=\EOR:k4=\EOS:ta=^I:pt:sr=5\EM:vt#3:xn:\
:ic=7\E[1@:dc=7\E[1P:al=9\E[1L:dl=9\E[1M:\
:sc=\E7:rc=\E8:cs=\E[%i%d;%dr:
# end
--------------------------(Cut Here)----------------------------
/* Jason Haines STD: (02) 73-4444
* ElecEng Undergraduate ISD: +61 2 73-4444
* 73 Davidson Avenue ACSnet: baron@runx
* Concord NSW 2137 CSNET: baron@runx.oz
* AUSTRALIA ARPA: baron%runx.oz@seismo.css.gov
*
* UUCP:
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*/