dir@cbosgd.UUCP (11/16/83)
1. Does anyone know whether people in England pass each other on the left when walking down the street? 2. Does anyone know how or why this custom began? 3. Are more people in England left-handed than people in other countries, or what? mail: cbosgd!dir
spear@ihopb.UUCP (Steven Spearman) (11/17/83)
On the escalators in subways, you stand on the right and walk (pass) on the left. On the sidewalks it is chaos like everywhere else. Steve Spearman ihnp4!ihopb!spear
budd@arizona.UUCP (11/17/83)
As I recall, yes they do. I found I was always bumping into people on the stairways until I figured out what the reason was.
mmt@dciem.UUCP (Martin Taylor) (11/17/83)
People in counter-walking crowds in England walk on whichever side the sign tells them not to. Since most signs (where there are any) say "Keep Left", or "Walk Left", therefore most people walk on the right. It's a feature of freedom from Government interference. More seriously, at a time when there were more countries with left-side driving, I saw a study on accident rates in which traffic density etc. had been partialled out of the analysis. Those countries with driving on the left had less traffic accidents than those with driving on the right. I have never seen a follow-up study, but it might be reasonable considering the difference in functional style of the two brain hemispheres. The contervailing traffic might be more ruly in its behaviour than the surprises that come from off the road. If so, it is not too great a stretch of the imagination to guess that a skilled driver might react quicker to an unexpected event seen on the left (right brain) than on the right. I know that's pushing our knowledge a long way past defensible bounds, but it's worth a thought. Martin Taylor
paul@uofm-cv.UUCP (Paul 'da Kingfish' Killey) (11/17/83)
A reason for that I have heard runs something like this: In England, Knights in Armor wanted their opponents on their sword hand side, so they rode on the left side of the road. In America, people were more into driving teams of horses, 40 mule teams, etc. They wanted their animals to be on their whip hand sides, and walked to the left of their wagons, which were on the right side of the road. Also, it kept the driver and wagon out of the ditch, etc. Is this what the question was about.
ajs@eisx.UUCP (A. Stillwell) (11/18/83)
I came from England to work here about two years ago. This is a subject that has fascinated me since I realised the reason for many collisions with people in the hallways (this can be a more or less pleasant experience, depending on whom you collide with). :-) After much consideration, these are my answers to the questions: 1. Does anyone know whether people in England pass each other on the left when walking down the street? Yes, they certainly do. I remember being told when I started the equivalent of High School that one must walk in the corridors on the left hand side, and I noticed that people generally pass each other on the left while walking on the pavement (that means 'sidewalk' in American English; confusing, isn't it?) when I visited Perfidious Albion this summer. 2. Does anyone know how or why this custom began? I am convinced that that the reason is linked to the practice of driving on the left in vehicles (I said vehicles because I believe the practice was around before automobiles). 3. Are more people in England left-handed than people in other countries, or what? Interesting idea, but I am not a southpaw, and I am not aware of any practice that has been influenced by left-handed people in England. In fact, I get the impression that sinistrals are as much a down-trodden group as they are here. I think the answer is lost in the mists of antiquity, unless someone else knows better. Incidentally, I still tend to walk down the 'wrong' side of hallways even now, despite having no trouble driving on the right. I put this down to the lack of real danger in failing to readjust the pedestrian habit, whereas the vehicular one brings obvious problems. Besides which, you make more friends bumping into people in halls... Tony Stillwell
david14@garfield.UUCP (David Janes) (11/18/83)
>2. Does anyone know how or why this custom began? > >3. Are more people in England left-handed than > people in other countries, or what? Actually, I believe the reasons for left hand driving are historical. Case 1: (before cars) Imagine someone driving down the road with a horse and buggy along the *right* hand side of the road. He uses a whip (in his right hand for ~90% of the people) to help control the horse's speed. <Crack> <Crack> (he now passes under a tree). <Crack><SNAG!>. Good-bye whip, which is now hanging from the tree he just passed under. Probably has a sore arm also ... No problem when passing on the left, since the whip is being used in the centre of the road. Case 2: (an earlier era, swords/rapiers/foils). Sir John Doe passes someone who intends to do him bodily harm. If he is passing on the right hand side, his sword (or pistol, etc.) will be on the opposite side of the person he wishes to attack. When passing on the left, no such problem occurs, since his sword will be on the right, the side of the person who is attacking him. (For similar reasons, stairs going up around a circular castle are clockwise, so the defender's arm will be free while the attacker's arm will always be against the wall, makeing it harder for him to fight.) I think this answers question three, or at least shows the fault in your logic to ask the question in the first place. dave ------- - David Janes (Memorial University of Newfoundland) ...!{allegra, inhp4, utcsrgv}!garfield!david14
smb@ulysses.UUCP (Steven Bellovin) (11/18/83)
My impression was that the custom originated in days of yore -- if you approached a stranger while on the left side of the road, your sword could cover him (the relevant case) more easily. (This assumes, of course, that you're right-handed, which may bear on the other part of the question.) But this theory doesn't explain why almost everyone else drives on the right.
irv@arizona.UUCP (11/18/83)
If I'm not mistaken, the reason people in England walk/drive on the
left comes from the fact that most are RIGHT handed. In the middle
ages when people fought each other on horses, they held their lance
in their right hands. They passed on the right (and hence rode on
the left) so that they could easily impale each other.
Irving J.P. Elshoff
University of Arizona
{allegra,cornell,ihnp4,kpno,mcnc,purdue,research,ucbvax}!arizona!irvirv@arizona.UUCP (11/18/83)
If I'm not mistaken, the reason people in England walk/drive on the left comes from the fact that most are RIGHT handed. In the middle ages when people fought each other on hor
nxn@ihuxm.UUCP (11/19/83)
*** Is it the convention here in the USA to walk to the right? No wonder I always end up dancing the two-step when I meet someone in a corridor (both to one side, then to the other side, etc.). I was unaware of any such convention in the UK during 25 years there, although it is common to stand on the right on escalators. I think the sword/lance convention would be the other way around (i.e the enemy passes on your left). It is better to have the shield towards the enemy than the weapon. This is both for protection and to enable a better swing. Try hitting a tennis ball without swinging the racquet back first. Personally, I don't think it matters which side one walks on, as long as one does it in an extremely silly manner. Dave (Python For Ever!) Nixon ihuxm!nxn
dee@cca.UUCP (Donald Eastlake) (11/19/83)
As I recall, although people drive on the left, trains on two track lines
normally run on the right hand track.
+ Donald E. Eastlake, III
ARPA: dee@CCA-UNIX usenet: {decvax,linus}!cca!deecunningh@noscvax.UUCP (11/19/83)
And in Japan as well. -- Bob Cunningham ..sdcsvax!noscvax!cunningh 21 17' 35" N 157 49' 38" W MILNET: cunningh@nosc-cc
rene@umcp-cs.UUCP (11/20/83)
When I went to Germany this past summer, I mistakenly believed that
most of Europe drove on the left. A girl from Munich came home with me
for a month when I left in August. I was worried about her being bored
when school started for me, so I said that she could borrow my
car to sight-see in. She replied, "I can't drive in the US! Don't you
all drive on the left?"
Has anyone else had the same type of mistaken belief?
- rene
--
Arpa: rene.umcp-cs@CSNet-relay
Uucp:...{allegra,seismo}!umcp-cs!renerfg@hound.UUCP (11/21/83)
As I recall there is only one railroad in the world where trains run on the left track: The Duluth, Mesabi and Iron Range. Don't know the reason. hound!rfg
david14@garfield.UUCP (David Janes) (11/21/83)
> I think the sword/lance convention would be the other way around (i.e the > enemy passes on your left). It is better to have the shield towards > the enemy than the weapon. This is both for protection and to enable > a better swing. Try hitting a tennis ball without swinging the racquet > back first. > Dave (Python For Ever!) Nixon ihuxm!nxn Actually, you can parry with your sword instead of blocking the blow with your shield, and you would still have to turn 90 degrees around in order fight the other person, so you unnecessarily waste time which is very important when you fight with swords. Also, most people who carry swords around when they travel have some confidence in their ability, and would rather fight an offensive battle rather than a defensive one. Although you are limited to a smaller swing (say, about 90 degrees), a larger swing would not increase the energy the sword has a great deal. There would be some loss of control, since you are moving your whole body rather than just mainly your arm. dave ------- - David Janes (Memorial University of Newfoundland) ...!{allegra, inhp4, utcsrgv}!garfield!david14
hal@cornell.UUCP (11/22/83)
Another railroad where the trains run on the left track: the Chicago
& Northwestern. Apparently it was designed by a British engineering firm.
Hal Perkins UUCP: {decvax|vax135|...}!cornell!hal
Cornell Computer Science ARPA: hal@cornell BITNET: hal@crnlcsmmt@dciem.UUCP (Martin Taylor) (11/22/83)
As I recall there is only one railroad in the world where
trains run on the left track: The Duluth, Mesabi and Iron
Range. Don't know the reason. hound!rfg
=======
After this question came up of which side of the track the trains run
I saw the last episode of "Great Train Journeys of the World" on PBS.
The final shots included the French TGV (super-fast train) which was
on the LEFT side of the double track. Was the film shown reversed?
Martin Taylor
--
Martin Taylor
{allegra,linus,ihnp4,uw-beaver,floyd,ubc-vision}!utcsrgv!dciem!mmtnxn@ihuxm.UUCP (11/24/83)
*** British railroads (railways) run left handed (the same as the roads), as is evident from the British Rail logo: --->-- --<--- I don't know whether this is true of all lines as BR was formerly many distinct companies, each with their own standards. Dave Nixon ihnp4!ihuxm!nxn
avsdT:deborah@avsdS.UUCP (11/30/83)
My understanding was that driving to the left in Britain started in the days of horse-drawn carriages. Since most drivers were right-handed, the buggy-whip holder was on the right-hand side of the carriage. If the carriage was driven on the right side of the road, the whip tended to get caught in the hedges so prevalent alongside the roads in England. So the carriage drivers tended to drive along the left-hand side of the road. Even if this story isn't true, I think it's a wonderful rationalization. Now, why do europeans hold their forks in their left hands? (Or alternately, why do americans hold theirs in their right hands?)
johnc@dartvax.UUCP (John Cabell) (12/03/83)
I think it makes more sense to hold your fork in your left
hand because then your right hand (usually the stronger) is
left (no pun intended) for cutting. I have no idea why the
americans switched to holding it in their right hands. Any
ideas?
from the ever-questioning mind of
johnc
:->mcq@druxt.UUCP (12/04/83)
Something I once heard concerning the American style of using a knife and fork as opposed to the European - It started just before the American Revolution and was used by the Sons of Liberty as a signal to recognize each other in public places. Can anybody verify or refute that one? Bob McQueer ihnp4!druxt!mcq
ignatz@ihuxx.UUCP (12/04/83)
Re the "why do people in America hold their forks in their left hand", I, too, have been told that it was a recognition sign by the "Sons of Liberty" in pre-revolutionary America. However, I was told that it came into popular use as one of many deliberate acts of rebellion by the populace at large. While unrest and dissatisfaction with the state of things were rising to the boiling point in Colonial America, many of the British traditions and customs were dropped or changed to protest and show disrespect of our "English masters"; this was one that survived. At least, so I've been taught at my mother's knee... Possibly full of misinformation, Dave Ihnat ihuxx!ignatz
ntt@dciem.UUCP (Mark Brader) (12/07/83)
As I recall, although people drive on the left, trains on two track lines
normally run on the right hand track.
+ Donald E. Eastlake, III
No, British trains certainly run on the left (with rare e\ceptions).
It is for good reason that the symbol for British Rail looks like this:
\
-------->------
/
------<--------
\
Left-hand running applies to underground (subway) trains as well as British
Rail. In North America, subway trains run on the right (in Toronto,
Montreal, San Francisco, New York, and Washington, anyway), but for ordinary
trains it varies from one line to another. In some places they run on the
right, in others one or both tracks may be used in either direction. I think
this is also the case in France.
I just returned from a quick visit to Sydney, Australia. Australians drive
on the left and the trains run on the left too (at least in Syndey). However,
whereas in England AND on the Toronto subway escalator users are supposed to
stand on the right, pass on the left, in Sydney it is the other way around.
I don't understand this.
Mark Brader, NTT Systems Inc., Toronto, Canadadejongh@osu-dbs.UUCP (12/09/83)
>> Why do europeans hold their forks in their left hands?
Having lived in Europe and Canada, as well as being a very big eater
(often hungry!) I think I can answer that. First of all, remember that the
fork is curved, so you can hold it over your plate with the curve upwards
(so that the prongs point upwards) or the curve downwards (the prongs point
down). Europeans hold the fork in their left hand with the prongs pointing
down for two reasons. First of all, this leaves the right hand free to
manipulate the knife, while the food in question is held steady with the fork
in the left hand. Secondly, the food can be immediately inserted in the mouth
as soon as it is cut. I like this aspect, because it enables me to eat much
faster! It is much more convenient than switch knife and fork with each cut,
or attempting to cut with the left hand (which is very difficult for a
right hander).
From the gourmet kitchen of:
Matt's French Grub