wkp@lanl-a.UUCP (08/31/84)
In reply to Yirmiyahu Ben-David's article on the Law of Return, I feel
that some points need to be cleared up:
A convert to Judaism making aliyah at no time deals with the Rabbanut
in Israel. His papers are cleared through the offices of the Jewish
Agency and the Israel Aliyah Center. Invariably, these personnel are
less religious, and hence less concerned about halacha. The result
of such a policy can be illustrated by a Hungarian friend of mine in
Israel (if he's still there) who made aliyah in 1981, became a citizen
and served in the army. However, when he wished to get married
he hd to go the Rabbanutt in Jerusalem, who promptly dismissed his
conversion because they did not trust the rabbi who had converted him.
Fortunately, there are not many cases like this, but there are enough so
that the religious parties want more of a say in aliyah. It should be
emphasized, however, that if a convert went to Israel already married,
there would be almost no instance when he/she would have to deal with the
Rabbanut.
I also cannot agree with Yirmiyahu's statement that the religious people
are that concerned about their own children marrying these "goyim" because
they (e.g., my cousin in Kfar Chabad) would not even marry a "baal tshuva"
(a Jew who became religious) much less any kind of convert, religous or
otherwise.
Finally, I feel that it is unfortunate that the religious parties (e.g.,
Kahana's Kach party) have such a say in the Knesset. Though I am
sympathetic to their ideals, I feel that many of them are hypocritical
and too eager to use the lives of young Jewish people to further their
own selfish aims.
bill peter
los alamos
The Mafdal people in Israel (national religious parties) wish to extend
their control of the marriageyiri@ucf-cs.UUCP (David) (09/04/84)
Thanks to Bill Peters for clarifying an implication I apparently (and inadverdantly) left open in my article. The papers are indeed submitted to the local shaliakh who forwards them to Jerusalem and awaits word from them - the potential oleh/olah does not have direct contact with the rabbinate. I take Bill's word for it regarding who processes it in Jerusalem. The bottom line though, judged from the results, must be that a lot of variance exists in the handling of these applications? Due perhaps to bureaucratzia? For authoritative (??) answers, the potential oleh/olah should inquire of the local shaliakh (again - beware of bureaucratzia). I must question the conclusions regarding orthodox concern for marriage of "goyim", etc. however. I refer readers to numerous and recent articles in the Jerusalem Post. I would agree however, that such arguments could be in some measure a smokescreen for religious ambition? The arguments are there. The question is their validity. (It is well worth noting that this is only one of a number of such arguments brought up in these JP articles - several of which readers may find worthy of discussion.) One point which I feel is unfair, and perhaps inadverdant, is the use of Kahana as the sole example of religious parties. Certainly he is not representative of religious parties. If anything, it would seem to me that he be treated separately from any of the other parties?
martillo@mit-athena.ARPA (Joaquim Martillo) (09/07/84)
A further note on the use of Kahana as an example of the religious parties in Israel. No Torah-Sage (I mean religious not this American conservative, reform or whatever dreck) has come out in support of Kahana's position. I will admit to generally despising Muslims (which is in fact the attitude of most non-Muslims who come from lands ruled by Muslims) but I do not think all the Arabs in Israel (either Christian or Muslim) should be expelled. I feel that the presence of Arabs within Israel will discourage the Arab Muslim nations from the use of atomics in a war against Israel if Arab Muslim nations should ever acquire atomic weapons (most Jews I have know who have actually lived in Arab Muslim nations disagree with me). Since Arab Muslims have a thousand year history of persecution of Jews, since no Arab Muslims anywhere show any evidence of being able to live with non-Muslims anywhere on terms of mutual respect and equality, since no Arab Muslim political leader will admit to owing any non-Muslims (including Jews) for centuries of mistreatment, and since Arab Muslim political leaders persistently call for the destruction of Israel and periodically lead their nations in war against Israel, Arab Muslims should not have the vote within the Land of Israel. Most Sefardim I know and in fact many Ashkenazim I know would consider illegitimate an Israeli government which, in order to come to power, depended on the Arab vote or on open or tacit Arab political party support.