kenw@lcuxc.UUCP (K Wolman) (01/18/85)
[Martillo writes:] > Since Rosen and Rubin are grovelers who prize their > connections to a non-Jewish community via leftist movements more than > any tie to the Jewish community, they will make apologies and > rationalizations for any leftist barbarism even if that barbarism is > directed at them themselves. Their behavior is just like the Ashkenazi > quislings in the Soviet Union who apologized for Soviet anti-Semitism as > a way of mobilizing the masses for the good of the Marxist cause. ------------------- Temper, temper, Mr. Martillo. While we're on the subject of Jews who sell out their brethren, apologize for barbarism, vote for Hitler, etc., I have some questions: In 1791, when France made its first moves toward emancipating its Jews, wasn't it the Sephardim who wanted to deny emancipation to their Ashkenazic brethren? Didn't it take almost TWO years for the differences to be worked out? Before you start blasting away at Rosen, Rubin, et. al. as Quislings and people who would have voted for Hitler, take a look at the less-than-glorious history of some people who decided there was room enough in the lifeboat only for them and that the rest of the family could stay on the sinking ship. Betrayal is not a value exclusive to all those disgusting VusVusim out there. Hab rochmones. -- CONTACT: Ken Wolman Bell Communications Research @ Livingston, NJ lcuxc!kenw (201) 740-4565 ("My doctorate's in Literature, but that seems like a pretty good pulse to me. . . .")
meth@csd2.UUCP (Asher Meth) (01/22/85)
[Ken Wolman writes] > In 1791, when France made its first moves toward emancipating > its Jews, wasn't it the Sephardim who wanted to deny emancipation > to their Ashkenazic brethren? Didn't it take almost TWO years ------ Didn't / doesn't emancipation lead to greater possibility of assimilation ? In which group do we find greater assimilation - Ashkenazim or Sephardim ? I do not know all the historical background implied by Ken Wolman, but must not these factors be taken into account, especially when arguing a point with Martillo ? asher meth allegra!cmcl2!csd2!meth ARPA meth@nyu-csd2.arpa
martillo@mit-athena.ARPA (Joaquim Martillo) (01/28/85)
I do not understand Ken Wolman's point about the rather dispicable behavior 200 years ago of certain Western Sefardim of no status within the Sefardic Community (French and Dutch Sefardim are of marano background and are not Sefardim Tehorim). Some Sefardim act like scum and therefore the behavior of leftist Ashkenazi slime of the past 100 years is excused? I should point out that somewhat earlier in history, Maria Theresa decided to expel the Jews of Bohemia and Moravia. Baron Aguilar, Dutch Sefardim and Viennese Sefardim at great inconvenience to themselves and financial loss successfully pressured the Imperial government to rescind this decree. The Sefardim acted despite the contempt they felt for Ashkenazim because Jewish morality required such behavior. There is no comparable act committed by Ashkenazim on behalf of Sefardim.
gadfly@ihu1m.UUCP (Gadfly) (01/31/85)
-- >> I should point out that somewhat earlier in history, Maria Theresa >> decided to expel the Jews of Bohemia and Moravia. Baron Aguilar, Dutch >> Sefardim and Viennese Sefardim at great inconvenience to themselves and >> financial loss successfully pressured the Imperial government to rescind >> this decree. The Sefardim acted despite the contempt they felt for >> Ashkenazim because Jewish morality required such behavior. There is no >> comparable act committed by Ashkenazim on behalf of Sefardim. There sure is--Mr. Martillo's continued good health attests to this :-) If any Goyim out there wonder why the mainstream (Ashkenazi) Jewish readership here exercises so much restraint and kindness in its replies to Martillo's vicious insults (indeed, most of his detractors on the net apparently are not Jews), well, Jewish morality requires such behavior. -- *** *** JE MAINTIENDRAI ***** ***** ****** ****** 31 Jan 85 [12 Pluviose An CXCIII] ken perlow ***** ***** (312)979-7188 ** ** ** ** ..ihnp4!iwsl8!ken *** ***
yossi@ahuta.UUCP (j.friedman) (02/01/85)
REFERENCES: <166@lcuxc.UUCP>, <3780001@csd2.UUCP>, <54@mit-athena.ARPA>, <271@ihu1m.UUCP> X from ken perlow > If any Goyim out there wonder why the mainstream (Ashkenazi) Jewish > readership here exercises so much restraint and kindness in its replies > to Martillo's vicious insults (indeed, most of his detractors on the net > apparently are not Jews), well, Jewish morality requires such behavior. Why is the "mainstream" Jewish readership necessarily Ashkenazi? Anyway, I think some of the restraint and kindness stems from "mainstream" readership's agreement with many of Martillo's pearls of wisdom, even if they don't agree with his methods of presentation. Joe Friedman AT&T-IS, Lincroft ahuta!yossi
yossi@ahuta.UUCP (j.friedman) (02/01/85)
REFERENCES: <166@lcuxc.UUCP>, <3780001@csd2.UUCP>, <54@mit-athena.ARPA>, <271@ihu1m.UUCP> from ken perlow > If any Goyim out there wonder why the mainstream (Ashkenazi) Jewish > readership here exercises so much restraint and kindness in its replies > to Martillo's vicious insults (indeed, most of his detractors on the net > apparently are not Jews), well, Jewish morality requires such behavior. Why is the "mainstream" Jewish readership necessarily Ashkenazi? Anyway, I think much of the "restraint and kindness" stems from "mainstream" readership's agreement with many of Martillo's pearls of wisdom, even if it doesn't agree with his methods of presentation. Joe Friedman AT&T-IS, Lincroft ahuta!yossi
dave@lsuc.UUCP (David Sherman) (02/04/85)
martillo@mit-athena.ARPA (Joaquim Martillo) writes: || There is no ||comparable act committed by Ashkenazim on behalf of Sefardim. Um, what about the rescue of Jews from Arab countries (e.g., Yemen) by Israel in the late 40's and early 50's, when Israel was run by Ashkenazim? Really, all of this is silly. We're all Jews. If we don't help each other, who will? Yakim, we hear you and appreciate the point you've been making for months. Now can we move on to better things than such infighting? Dave Sherman -- {utzoo pesnta nrcaero utcs}!lsuc!dave {allegra decvax ihnp4 linus}!utcsrgv!lsuc!dave
gadfly@ihu1m.UUCP (Gadfly) (02/05/85)
-- >> Why is the "mainstream" Jewish readership necessarily >> Ashkenazi? Anyway, I think much of the "restraint and kindness" >> stems from "mainstream" readership's agreement with many of >> Martillo's pearls of wisdom, even if it doesn't agree with his >> methods of presentation. >> Joe Friedman I assume that most of USENET's Jewish readership is American and of Ashkenazi lineage. That's what I meant by "mainstream". If I'm wrong, or even a sizable percentage are non-Ashkenazi, please enlighten me. Martillo has many pearls of wisdom, indeed. And his perspective is usually refreshing. But the Ashkenazim==leftist vusvus scum we can all do without. If you are Askenazi, Joe, have you no pride in your family? I do--and leftist they were, and are--and I'm proud of them. So I have to wonder, when Martillo says these horrible things--*WHAT'S THE POINT?* I should not be proud of my family? What does he propose I do--sit shiva for them? Maybe I should give him all my worldly possessions to atone for their alleged crimes? Martillo of all people should know that it is as misguided as it is dangerous to try to make people ashamed of who they are. -- *** *** JE MAINTIENDRAI ***** ***** ****** ****** 04 Feb 85 [16 Pluviose An CXCIII] ken perlow ***** ***** (312)979-7188 ** ** ** ** ..ihnp4!iwsl8!ken *** ***