[net.religion.jewish] Terrorism

lazarus@brahms.BERKELEY.EDU (Andrew J &) (11/17/85)

In article <411@houem.UUCP> niko@houem.UUCP (N.TSOLAS) writes:
>
>I have met some and I heard that in Israel there is a minority
>of Israelis who sympathize with them [Palestinians]. But the government's
>official policy for solving the Palestinian problem is by
>extermination.( Don't tell me about the people who live in the
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>West Bank. It is a matter of time for them to leave their homes)
 
Even assuming that Mr. Tsolas is correct, in the English language
requiring people to leave their homes in *not* extermination.

(The premise is also open to question, since this is an overt
policy of only 1 member of the Israeli parliament, Meir Kahane,
a real sicko.  I must admit, however, that the Likud party has
been distressing cavalier towards the property owners of the
West Bank.)

andy

niko@houem.UUCP (N.TSOLAS) (11/19/85)

 
>Even assuming that Mr. Tsolas is correct, in the English language
>requiring people to leave their homes in *not* extermination.

True, but forcible exile leads to extermination. In addition,
Palestineans are not only exiled but also they are hunted by
Arabs as well. And I am comming again in my original question.
"What would you, or anybody else, do in their situation?"

lazarus@brahms.BERKELEY.EDU (Andrew J &) (11/25/85)

In article <416@houem.UUCP> niko@houem.UUCP (N.TSOLAS) writes:
>
> 
>>Even assuming that Mr. Tsolas is correct, in the English language
>>requiring people to leave their homes in *not* extermination.
>
>True, but forcible exile leads to extermination.

The Jews are themselves evidence that this is not true.

andy

tim@k.cs.cmu.edu (Tim Maroney) (11/29/85)

> >>Even assuming that Mr. Tsolas is correct, in the English language
> >>requiring people to leave their homes in *not* extermination.
> >
> >True, but forcible exile leads to extermination.
>
> The Jews are themselves evidence that this is not true.

Are we talking about the same Jews?  I would say that Jewish history,
particularly in this century, furnishes a great deal of evidence that exile
DOES lead to extermination attempts.  However, even if it were not so, the
Jews have suffered greatly from repeated exiles, and the history of Judaism
demonstrates graphically the horror of forced migration.  Can you really
repeat this process for your enemies in good conscience?
-=-
Tim Maroney, Electronic Village Idiot, CMU Center for Art and Technology
tim@k.cs.cmu.edu       | uucp: {seismo,decwrl,ucbvax,etc.}!k.cs.cmu.edu!tim
CompuServe: 74176,1360 | CMU. Tomorrow's networking nightmares -- today!

warren@pluto.UUCP (Warren Burstein) (12/03/85)

In article <683@k.cs.cmu.edu>, tim@k.cs.cmu.edu (Tim Maroney) writes:
>4 Even assuming that Mr. Tsolas is correct, in the English language
>4 requiring people to leave their homes in *not* extermination.
>3 True, but forcible exile leads to extermination.
>2 The Jews are themselves evidence that this is not true.
> Are we talking about the same Jews?  I would say that Jewish history,
> particularly in this century, furnishes a great deal of evidence that exile
> DOES lead to extermination attempts.  However, even if it were not so, the
> Jews have suffered greatly from repeated exiles, and the history of Judaism
> demonstrates graphically the horror of forced migration.  Can you really
> repeat this process for your enemies in good conscience?

The objection to Tsolas was that he said that the policy of Israel was
to exterminate the Arabs in territories under its control.  He brought
as evidence that Israel plans to expel them.  There were two objections:
1) There is a world of difference between exile and genocide.
2) The government of Israel supports neither.

lazarus@brahms.BERKELEY.EDU (Andrew J &) (12/04/85)

In article <683@k.cs.cmu.edu> tim@k.cs.cmu.edu (Tim Maroney) writes:
>> >>Even assuming that Mr. Tsolas is correct, in the English language
>> >>requiring people to leave their homes in *not* extermination.
>> >
>> >True, but forcible exile leads to extermination.
>>
>> The Jews are themselves evidence that this is not true.
>
>Are we talking about the same Jews?  I would say that Jewish history,
>particularly in this century, furnishes a great deal of evidence that exile
>DOES lead to extermination attempts.  However, even if it were not so, the
>Jews have suffered greatly from repeated exiles, and the history of Judaism
>demonstrates graphically the horror of forced migration.  Can you really
>repeat this process for your enemies in good conscience?
>-=-
The answer to the last question is NO (see my other postings).

However, even with respect to the Jews, the people doing the exiling
were not always bent on extermination.  I just wanted to make clear
that the two are not equivalent concepts and that it is possible to
suffer one without the other.

In view of the Palestinians' close ties to other, large ethnic
groups, I would say that the only way they could be exterminated
is by global nuclear war.

andy

buchbind@agrigene.UUCP (12/04/85)

> >>Even assuming that Mr. Tsolas is correct, in the English language
> >>requiring people to leave their homes in *not* extermination.
> >
> >True, but forcible exile leads to extermination.

	No, it leads to loss of identity, not extermination (i.e. biological
death or lack of reproduction).

> The Jews are themselves evidence that this is not true.

	The Jews are an 'exception that proves the rule'.  We show that it is
possible but unlikely.  (And what happened to the exiled inhabitants of the
Northern Kingdom?  Their descendant have been 'swallowed by history, though
those that were not exiled [the Samaritans] still exist.)
-- 
    Barry Buchbinder			    (608)221-5000
Agrigenetics Corp.; 5649 E. Buckeye Rd.; Madison WI 53716 USA
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