arig@cvl.UUCP (Ari Gross) (11/18/85)
> The premise is also open to question, since this is an overt > policy of only 1 member of the Israeli parliament, Meir Kahane, > a real sicko. I must admit, however, that the Likud party has > been distressing cavalier towards the property owners of the > West Bank. > andy Recent public opinion polls in Israel have predicted that Meir Kahane could win as many as 12 seats if elections were held in the near future. Now why might so many people vote for "a real sicko" like Kahane ? Could it be because he says crazy things like "the Land of Israel belongs to the Jewish People" and "Arabs that cannot reconcile themselves to the fact that Israel is here to stay should strongly consider relocating"? Maybe it's his outrageous "racist" statements like "the Jews are G-d's Chosen People"? ari gross
lazarus@brahms.BERKELEY.EDU (Andrew J &) (11/20/85)
In article <970@cvl.UUCP> arig@cvl.UUCP (Ari Gross) writes: > Recent public opinion polls in Israel have predicted that >Meir Kahane could win as many as 12 seats if elections were >held in the near future. Now why might so many people vote for >"a real sicko" like Kahane ? Could it be because he says crazy >things like "the Land of Israel belongs to the Jewish People" >and "Arabs that cannot reconcile themselves to the fact that >Israel is here to stay should strongly consider relocating"? >Maybe it's his outrageous "racist" statements like "the Jews >are G-d's Chosen People"? > > ari gross The _New Republic_ article on Kahane ("A Jewish Monster") is recommended for anyone who wants to know what Kahane is really saying. (This magazine takes a strongly *pro-Israel, pro-Zionist, anti-PLO* stance.) He is quite explicit -- Arabs should be expelled, period. Last year he suggested a South-Africa-like ban on Jewish/Arab sexual relations. BTW, everybody's favorite ultra-sicko Adolf Hitler won more than 12 Reichstag seats in 1932, so this argument doesn't overwhelm me. andy
mr@homxb.UUCP (M.RINDSBERG) (11/24/85)
> In article <970@cvl.UUCP> arig@cvl.UUCP (Ari Gross) writes: > > Recent public opinion polls in Israel have predicted that > >Meir Kahane could win as many as 12 seats if elections were > >held in the near future. Now why might so many people vote for > >"a real sicko" like Kahane ? Could it be because he says crazy > >things like "the Land of Israel belongs to the Jewish People" > >and "Arabs that cannot reconcile themselves to the fact that > >Israel is here to stay should strongly consider relocating"? > >Maybe it's his outrageous "racist" statements like "the Jews > >are G-d's Chosen People"? > > > > ari gross > > The _New Republic_ article on Kahane ("A Jewish Monster") is recommended > for anyone who wants to know what Kahane is really saying. (This magazine > takes a strongly *pro-Israel, pro-Zionist, anti-PLO* stance.) > > He is quite explicit -- Arabs should be expelled, period. What is wrong with expelling the arabs ???? Obviously they are not happy in Israel (i.e. terrorist actions, etc) so what is wrong with handing them over to their brothers in 22 other muslim countries where they can live however they please. Actually the problem is that arabs in Israel are very happy. Arabs in Israel live better than they would in any other country in the middle east. There is wonderful social security, and they do not have to serve in the army nor pay taxes. BTW, Expelling is not a new thing, it has been performed many times before with perfect results. > Last year he suggested a South-Africa-like ban on Jewish/Arab sexual relations > > BTW, everybody's favorite ultra-sicko Adolf Hitler won more than > 12 Reichstag seats in 1932, so this argument doesn't overwhelm me. > andy Some comparison !!!! mark
lazarus@brahms.BERKELEY.EDU (Andrew J &) (12/04/85)
In article <939@homxb.UUCP> mr@homxb.UUCP (M.RINDSBERG) writes: [ >> is me] >> >> The _New Republic_ article on Kahane ("A Jewish Monster") is recommended >> for anyone who wants to know what Kahane is really saying. (This magazine >> takes a strongly *pro-Israel, pro-Zionist, anti-PLO* stance.) >> >> He is quite explicit -- Arabs should be expelled, period. > >What is wrong with expelling the arabs ???? Obviously they are not happy in >Israel (i.e. terrorist actions, etc) so what is wrong with handing >them over to their brothers in 22 other muslim countries where they can live >however they please. >Actually the problem is that arabs in Israel are very happy. >Arabs in Israel live better than they would in any >other country in the middle east. There is wonderful social security, and they >do not have to serve in the army nor pay taxes. I don't quite understand the meaning of this?! The Arabs in Israel proper are neither eager to leave (they could easily do so) nor very happy. They are, however, at home, where their families lived before them. I suspect the claim that they pay no taxes is rubbish, but perhaps someone else can enlighten us. If the Israeli Arabs are 'very happy', that would be yet another argument *against* expelling them. >BTW, Expelling is not a new thing, it has been performed many times before >with perfect results. Yeah? And many times with unpleasant results: Spain 1492, Portugal 1496. Let's try Vietnamese boat people (many of Chinese ancestry). How about the Five Civilized Tribes of Florida, or the Nez Perce, or any of the other major American Indian tribes. Come on, you tell me, what are these 'perfect' expulsions. I didn't say that Kahane's ideas were new (even for Jews, if we look back at the Maccabees). I said they were sick. >> BTW, everybody's favorite ultra-sicko Adolf Hitler won more than >> 12 Reichstag seats in 1932, so this argument doesn't overwhelm me. >> andy > >Some comparison !!!! > > mark If you (or more accurately, Ari Gross) wish to argue that Kahane is respectable because he might win 12 seats in the Knesset, then you *have to explain* why the same reasoning does not apply to Hitler. This comparison was extreme and chosen deliberately to indicate that your argument is fallacious. andy
mr@homxb.UUCP (M.RINDSBERG) (12/06/85)
> In article <939@homxb.UUCP> mr@homxb.UUCP (M.RINDSBERG) writes: > [ >> is me] > >> > >> The _New Republic_ article on Kahane ("A Jewish Monster") is recommended > >> for anyone who wants to know what Kahane is really saying. (This magazine > >> takes a strongly *pro-Israel, pro-Zionist, anti-PLO* stance.) > >> > >> He is quite explicit -- Arabs should be expelled, period. > > > >What is wrong with expelling the arabs ???? Obviously they are not happy in > >Israel (i.e. terrorist actions, etc) so what is wrong with handing > >them over to their brothers in 22 other muslim countries where they can live > >however they please. > >Actually the problem is that arabs in Israel are very happy. > >Arabs in Israel live better than they would in any > >other country in the middle east.There is wonderful social security, and they > >do not have to serve in the army nor pay taxes. > > I don't quite understand the meaning of this?! The Arabs in Israel proper > are neither eager to leave (they could easily do so) nor very happy. > They are, however, at home, where their families lived before them. > I suspect the claim that they pay no taxes is rubbish, but perhaps > someone else can enlighten us. > If the Israeli Arabs are 'very happy', that would be yet another > argument *against* expelling them. > > >BTW, Expelling is not a new thing, it has been performed many times before > >with perfect results. > > Yeah? And many times with unpleasant results: Spain 1492, Portugal 1496. > Let's try Vietnamese boat people (many of Chinese ancestry). > How about the Five Civilized Tribes of Florida, or the Nez Perce, > or any of the other major American Indian tribes. > Come on, you tell me, what are these 'perfect' expulsions. > > I didn't say that Kahane's ideas were new (even for Jews, if we > look back at the Maccabees). I said they were sick. > > >> BTW, everybody's favorite ultra-sicko Adolf Hitler won more than > >> 12 Reichstag seats in 1932, so this argument doesn't overwhelm me. > >> andy > > > >Some comparison !!!! > > > > mark > > If you (or more accurately, Ari Gross) wish to argue that Kahane is > respectable because he might win 12 seats in the Knesset, then > you *have to explain* why the same reasoning does not apply > to Hitler. This comparison was extreme and chosen deliberately > to indicate that your argument is fallacious. > andy Kahane is NOT advocating the killing of anybody !!!! Hitler DID ! mark