[net.religion.jewish] The notion of Hell

laura@l5.uucp (Laura Creighton) (12/23/85)

I didn't want to post this, but this has gone on long enough.

2 years ago I went to a week long series of lectures at U of Toronto given
by an wonderfully erudite Jewish religious scholar who lives in Israel.
Unfortunately, I cannot remember his name.  Next week my stuff is promised 
to arrive, so if I have it written down there, I will post it.  In the meantime
I have cross posted this to net.religion.jewish in the hope that someone there
might be able to identify him.

He is a renowned scholar in Hebrew, who has been criticised for the arhceology
that he feels is essential to true religious scholarship.  He is responsible
for a lot of translations of the Dead Sea Scrolls, and has devoted his life
to the study of the roots of Judaism.  He is as much an expert on the
Sadducees as there is, and perhaps the greatest living authority on the
Essenes.  He speaks with a heavy accent and is hard to listen to, but a
marvellous speaker in any case.

Any takers?

He appears to have conclusively demonstrated that John the Baptist was an
Essene who had rejected the doctrine of Double-Predestination (if that rings
any Christian bells..)  I *wish* I could remember his name.

But back to hell...

At the time of Christ, there was a big religious split among the Jews.  The
Sadducees (about whom little is known) did not believe in an afterlife, or
at least did not believe in an afterlife as the Pharisees did.  So when
Jesus gets asked about the afterlife in front of Pharisees and Sadducess, this
is a *real* *big* *thing* -- he is being asked to rule on which of the major
sects of contemporary (for him) Judaism is full of it.

The Essenes were a third major sect, but they were monks who fled
cities and towns as ``places of corruption'' and lived in their monestaries
practicing as harsh a way of life as they could develop.  Some of their
writings have been preserved, so we know more about htem than we do about
the Sadducees.  They had a very well developed idea of Hell as a big place
of eternal torment.  they linked this place to Sheol.  And they believed
that only the Essenes had been predestined by God to be saved, and that
in virtue of their being Essenes, they should do penance and live a harsh
life for the rest of their lives to demonstrate that they are saved and
that they really regretted their wretched state.

This appears to be the reason that John the Baptist broke with them -- he
thought that if you sincerely repented for your sins, you could be saved,
whereas the Essenes believed that only those destined by God to be saved
were going to be saved -- if you were not destined by God to be saved 
then all the repenting in the world wasn't going to help you.

Soooo,

Jesus did not invent the idea of Hell.  That idea was already well-established
in Essene thought long before Jesus was born.  But since the Essenes had
religious disputes with both the Pharisees and the Sadducees over Hell, it
seems also clear that Jesus' ideas on Hell would not be accepted by a great
many Jews of Jesus' time.  [At the very least those who disagreed with the
Essenes over the *existence* of Hell and those who disagreed with the
Essenes over whether or not there was *any* torment in Hell would disagree
with Jesus.]

Buuut,
it is not necessary to look at Jesus' condemnation of the Pharisees to conclude
that Jesus was anti-Jew.  All you have to do is read the book of John.  I
have a 40 page essay on that coming with my stuff -- I can post the juicy
parts if you like.  But my conclusion from that was not that Jesus was
anti-Jew (who can tell?) but that rather the author(s) of John spoke for
a population that had a large Samartitan element and that these people had
had great trouble with existing populations of Jews.  The Acts of the Apostles
talks about how ``the Jews'' kicked out the Christians from preaching about
Jesus in the synagogues.  If you were one of these people, you might have
very good reason to resent Jews in general since you had sufferred at their
hands -- but this of course does not mean that Jesus resented the Jews.
Actually, I find it rather hard to envision Jesus resenting *anybody* --
getting angry and losing his temper, yes, but deep long term resentment, no.