[net.religion.jewish] The Tragedy of Assimilation

meth@csd2.UUCP (Asher Meth) (01/02/86)

I came across this "letter" in a recent Jewish weekly paper. It was entitled 

               "A Letter to the Gentile Partner".

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Gentile,

This letter is written to you, the partner of a Jew whom you hope to marry, in
the hope that it will enable you to retain your self-respect and find someone
who truly respects you.

You met your Jewish partner and fell in love. You and your partner both wish
to marry. But there is a problem. Your partner's parents are opposed - perhaps
adamantly so, perhaps a bit less, but nevertheless opposed - to their child
marrying a gentile. Only you know how much debate and anguish have gone into
attempting to solve the problem, how many hours of discussion have been held
between your Jewish partner and the parents and between you and the partner.

And finally, an answer ! Perhaps it was a reluctant one, reluctantly agreed to
by the Jewish parents. Perhaps it was a reluctant one on *your* part. Perhaps
it came easily. No matter. At last an answer that promised a solution to the
problem, an end to the opposition of the Jewish parents. That answer ? A simple
one : Why do you not agree to convert ? Why do you not agree to become a Jew ?

Why, it is so simple, your partner told you. My parents will then accept you,
we can be married and live happily ever after. And it really doesn't mean
anything. You certainly won't have to observe Judaism; after all I don't. It's
just a form, a ritual, something to make my parents feel better. And if you
agree, any Reform or Conservative rabbi will marry us without questions asked.
Think about it, darling; a little ritual, and love will conquer all.

And so you agreed. Not too happily because, after all, you are not Jewish and
never thought of wanting to be Jewish and don't really *want* to be Jewish, but
the thought of getting rid of all the hassle and finally getting married made
you agree. In the end, you agreed with your partner that it wasn't really the
laws that were important as the in-laws.

Dear gentile partner, think. You love your Jewish partner and you are
convinced that he or she shares that love, loves you in return. But the greater
question is : Can love survive without any *respect* ? And the greatest question
is, of course : In light of what your Jewish partner has asked you to do, what
respect can he or she possibly have for you ?

Religion, whether one believes in it or not, is one of the birthrights of
human beings. Your ancestors believed in and fought for the principles of your
faith and whether you really observe them or believe in them fully, asking you
to throw your religion away as a cynical, pragmatic move just to satisfy your
Jewish partner's parents is a move of such contempt for you, that it is
difficult to understand your lack of respect for *yourself* !

Why doesn't your Jewish partner offer to convert to *your* faith ? If
conversion is just a ritual (read : game) why is your partner not prepared to
make the simple move in this "game" ? Why such lack of respect for you that he
or she so flippantly asks you to drop your faith and tradition and cause pain
to *your* parents and family (no matter how little they may show it) ? Think
carefully. Is such a person one who really respects you ? Is this the kind of
unselfish partner who will give to you and sacrifice for you in time of need ?
Or is this a spoiled and selfish child who - for what he or she desires - is
prepared to have others pay for those pleasures ? Is this Jewish American
Prince or Princess what you really need ?

I think not. I think that there is nothing more important in this world - *more
than love* - than respect. And a person who, because he or she has not the will
or courage to face down parents, asks you to sacrifice your faith and tradition
and cause such inner pain to your family, simply has no respect for you.

And more. Your Jewish partner has no respect for his or her own religion,
either. Anyone who can tell you to go through a farce and a fraud of conversion
without really caring or feeling for Judaism, has nothing but contempt for his
or her own faith. And with all that in mind it becomes clear that *you are
dealing with someone who, ultimately, has no self-respect either*.

Accept this advice, the best advice you may ever get in your life, advice that
will spare you heartache and a terrible marriage. Tell your Jewish partner, no.
No, I really think that this will not work. Tell your Jewish partner that you
have too much self-respect to go through a fraud and farce that mocks Judaism,
your own faith and yourself.

Grasp courage. For your own sake, have the will and strength to break away from
a person whose character is so set that it will be excruciatingly difficult, if
not impossible, to change.

Marriage with such a person will be a disaster, a guarantee of contempt : from
him to you, from you to him, from you to yourself.

You are what you are. You have roots and traditions. Hold on to them. Find a
partner who respects you and those roots, who can share them with you and would
never dream of having you mock and degrade those laws for the sake of pacifying
in-laws.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 

Asher Meth ....... meth@nyu-csd2.arpa ....... allegra!cmcl2!csd2!meth

figmo@lll-crg.ARpA (Lynn Gold) (01/08/86)

As a Jew married to a Gentile who is the daughter of a Jew who got his
fiancee to convert, I agree that the pressure put upon Gentile partners
of Jews to convert is absurd; it really ticks me off that many rabbis
would rather give a Jew up for dead than marry them to a non-Jew.

I saw what kind of Jew my mother became and decided that it was absurd
to ask my husband to convert.  I'd rather have a non-Jew for a spouse
than a pseudo-Jew any day!

--Lynn Gold
...lll-crg!figmo

evan@pedsgo.UUCP (Evan Marcus) (01/10/86)

Organization : Concurrent Computer Corp. (a P-E subsidiary), Tinton Falls, NJ
Keywords: 

In article <1172@lll-crg.ARpA> figmo@lll-crg.ARpA (Lynn Gold) writes:
>As a Jew married to a Gentile who is the daughter of a Jew who got his
>fiancee to convert, I agree that the pressure put upon Gentile partners
>of Jews to convert is absurd; it really ticks me off that many rabbis
>would rather give a Jew up for dead than marry them to a non-Jew.
>
>I saw what kind of Jew my mother became and decided that it was absurd
>to ask my husband to convert.  I'd rather have a non-Jew for a spouse
>than a pseudo-Jew any day!
>
>--Lynn Gold
>...lll-crg!figmo

The answer is quite simple--that is the tradition and the law.  A Jew who
marries out of the faith is (according to the Bible, I believe) supposed to
be given up for dead.  Rabbis who do perform mixed marriages are few and
far between partially because of this, but also because they stand to lose
prestige in the Jewish community.

And personally, as a single Jewish man, I would rather marry a 'pseudo'-Jew
than a non-Jew.  My parents agree with me, though that is NOT why I
maintain this preference. 
-- 
NAME:   Evan L. Marcus
UUCP:   ...vax135!petsd!pedsgd!pedsgo!evan
USnail: CONCURRENT Computer Corporation (formerly Perkin-Elmer DSG)
	M/S 308, 106 Apple St., Tinton Falls, NJ  07724
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LIVE:   "Hey, Evan"
QUOTE:  What is life?  Life is one damned thing after another. - M. Twain.

warren@pluto.UUCP (Warren Burstein) (01/12/86)

> The answer is quite simple--that is the tradition and the law.  A Jew who
> marries out of the faith is (according to the Bible, I believe) supposed to
> be given up for dead.

Where is your source for this?  I know of none.  You overstate Judaism's
prohibition of intermarriage.  This prohibition is the reason Rabbis
don't perform mixed marriages (or shouldn't, in the case of those who
do).  Lynn was speaking figuratively when she said "many rabbis would
rather give a Jew up for dead than marry them to a non-Jew."  

> And personally, as a single Jewish man, I would rather marry a 'pseudo'-Jew
> than a non-Jew.  My parents agree with me, though that is NOT why I
> maintain this preference. 

Why not marry a Jew whose status is not in doubt?  Avoid the problem
by not getting romantically involved with someone who will need to
be converted.

paulb@ttidcc.UUCP (Paul Blumstein) (01/13/86)

In article <143@pedsgo.UUCP> evan@pedsgo.UUCP (Evan Marcus) writes:
>                  ...  Rabbis who do perform mixed marriages are few and
>far between partially because of this, but also because they stand to lose
>prestige in the Jewish community...

I would like to think so also, but the LA Times published the results
of a survey on 1/11 that said that 40% of Southern Californian Reform
Rabbis would perform a mixed marriage.   When do we say Kaddish for
American Judiasm?????
-- 
-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
Paul Blumstein                                 "I deny this reality!"
Citicorp/TTI                                         Doctor Who
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.
Santa Monica, CA  90405
(213) 450-9111          {philabs,randvax,trwrb,vortex}!ttidca!paulb

dsg@mhuxi.UUCP (David S. Green) (01/14/86)

> 
> You might think differently if you lived in such a household.  My mother
> would go through great lengths to get my father to eat on Yom Kippur and
> to eat bread during Pesach.  After a while, he succumbed.  Mom once hit
> me for completing an expletive of hers (she yelled "Jesus!" and I yelled
> "Christ!"  This isn't supposed to mean anything in a Jewish home.), and
> once scolded me for not knowing the words to "the Lord's Prayer" (if it
> hadn't been a pop song at the time, I wouldn't have known what she was
> talking about).
> --Lynn Gold

Lynn, you've just showed some of us part of the "tragedy of assimilation."

meth@csd2.UUCP (01/29/86)

This is written in response to Andrew Jonathan Fine's response to my posting.

>Concerning the letter, I must respectfully disagree with some of it's premises:

I will grant that you may disagree based on your personal opinions. But, if you
wish to base it on religious grounds, or wish to say that Judaism does not
agree with the premises offered, you must first profess to be well-versed in
Judaism. I say this not, G-d forbid, to lecture you or to profess a "holier 
than thou" attitude. Rather, to remind ourselves of a previous article you ,
posted, with the title "Beacon from a lost sheep from 11 light years away". 
Thus, as you yourself write :
>I cannot claim to be Jewish even though I was born so, because I am not capable
>of faith.  
Thus, your comments are not necessarily rooted in Judaism and should not be used
as a basis or a banner for "Jewish opinion".

As far as being a "lost sheep", we *do* 
>"want to contact and advise a castaway civilization trying to re-establish 
>contact", 
as you asked in your previous posting.

This makes it all the more difficult to respond. I dare not "shoot from the
hip" (not that I am that kind of a person) for fear of further alienating you.
Yet, I must protect my flank and refute that which may be portrayed as Jewish
ideas & Judaism, when in reality it is not. I think that my colleague Pinchas
Klahr did a fine job in his initial response to your query.

>One premise is that religious and cultural roots must be shared to make a
>successful marriage. Not so.  Marriage is built more on differences than
>likenesses.  

As far as Judaism is concerned, religious roots must be shared. If one partner
is not Jewish, how can he/she "carry on the faith"; the Jewsih partner has 
already broken serious barriers by marrying out of the faith. What about the 
children ? Judaism recognizes maternal lineage only (with respect to religion of
the child). When you play a game (such as the game of life) you have to play by
the rules. You can't adjust, change, or throw out some rules just because it is
inconvenient for you to adhere to them. Judaism places a strong emphasis on the
family structure & the home. Note that today's society has moved far from this;
the results are disastrous (broken homes, no sense of purpose, etc.).

Yes, sharing of cultural roots may not be necessary for a successful marriage;
but it can't hurt to have similar cultural backgrounds. Diversity is important,
but don't discount the advantages of similarity.

Yes, marriage is a "partnership of compromise". But isn't life the same thing ?
The only difference is that marriage is a lot "closer to home" than outside
relationships.

>So long as the partners agree to disagree and respect each other's
>differences, all will be well.

I don't know if "all will be well". It may be easier to agree *before* you get
tangled up in all the details. But once you get "into the pit" and have to
start disagreeing, it may not be that easy to give in and to "respect the
other's differences."

>Another premise is that anyone who is willing to give up a culture is beneath
>contempt.  Tell me, if *you* found an SO who was everything you wanted, needed,
>respected, and loved, with the exception of religion, would you rather stay
>single just to be faithful, or would you marry the person and hope the religion
>can be accomodated?  

As far as I am concerned, "with the exception of religion" is a contradiction
to "everything you wanted, needed, respected, and loved". If the religion isn't
there, then it is not what I want or need. I may respect the person (I respect
many people who are not religious Jews, or even Jews for that matter) for being
a human being whom I think is worhty of my respect. I may even consider that
person as one of my friends. But, what I want and need as far as a marriage
partner (a partner in life & for life) is intrinsically defined by the religion
aspect. 

The bottom line is that religion *cannot* be accomodated. Religion and
religious practice cannot be subject to my every whim and fancy. Let me repeat
that : Religion and religious practice cannot be subject to my every whim and
fancy. For if it were, it would be subject to your every whim and fancy, too;
and to his, and hers, and that one's, too. At that point, it ceases to be a
religion and becomes just another fad, to be interpretted by each individual as
(s)he sees fit.

>From my understanding of religion in general and certain advice I received on
>Judaism, there is an outer form and an inner form of being Jewish.  
> ...... The purists may consider it
>undesireable, but it is the soul that matters, not the acts, in the long run.

I am not familiar with this terminology. Assuming that it is correct (i.e., has
firm basis in religious Jewish theology), the inner & outer forms, the thought
& the acts, must be inherently & intrinsically intertwined and inter-dependent.
One without the other is incomplete and lacking.

>In terms of children, I would allow circumcision for the male baby
>to allow it the option of being Jewish upon maturity. 

Being circumcized does not a Jew make. Circumcision of all male children on the
eighth day is mandated in the Torah. If it cannot be performed on that day due
to health reasons (or, if for some reason it was not performed then), then it
is to be performed as soon thereafter as possible.

Asher Meth ....... meth@nyu-csd2.arpa ....... allegra!cmcl2!csd2!meth

meth@csd2.UUCP (01/29/86)

Andrew Jonathan Fine writes :
----------------------------------------
From my understanding of religion in general and certain advice I received on
Judaism, there is an outer form and an inner form of being Jewish.  The outer
form is acts, the inner form is faith, thought, and feelings.  The outer form
is simply the way Judaism interacts with the world to set an example before the
world.  The inner form is the way a Jewish person interacts with God.  When in
doubt or need, the inner form is all that is the required, since the outer form
is not always possible due to circumstance.
----------------------------------------

I'd like to respond concerning these two aspects of man's relationship : with
man & with G-d. 

Last year, I heard the following thought from Rabbi Yehuda Amital, a Rosh
Yeshiva at Yeshivat Har Etzion, Alon Shevut, ISRAEL.
(A "Rosh Yeshiva" is a Dean of a religious Jewish institute of higher education,
where the texts are the Written & the Oral law, with a strong emphasis on the 
study of Talmud & its commentaries.)
This yeshiva is a "hesder yeshiva", where the Israeli students enroll at age 18
in a 5-year program, combining yeshiva studies with service in the Israeli
Defense Forces. American students do not go to the army, but participate in all
other yeshiva activities - study, guard duty, kitchen duty, etc. 

Rabbi Amital has become involved in groups that work with people who wish to
become more acquainted with their Jewish roots. One couple said to him - we
wish to become religious, observant Jews, but are not ready to accept all the
laws & rules all at once. We are afraid that we will not be able to swim; we
may sink. 

He responded, there is a verse in the Torah that instructs you in your quest.
In last week's portion, Beshallach, Shemos/Exodus 15:25, we are told that G-d
gave some commandments to the Israelites before the revelation at Sinai -
"Sham sam lo chok umishpat vesham nisahu", there He gave him laws & laws
(different types) and there He tested him. RaSHI explains that the Jews
received three commandments at Marrah : (1) the Sabbath, (2) the laws of the red
heifer ("parah adumah"), and (3) "dinim" (that the society must institute a 
judicial system). Rabbi Amital told the couple to guide themselves by that which
is alluded to in this verse. 

(1) Accept the Sabbath as a day of rest; rest from all your worries, rest from 
all your business concerns; rest from work, etc. (to the best of your ability, 
with respect to keeping the holiness of the Sabbath).

(2) The laws of the "parah adumah" are called "chok" - a law that we do not
fully understand. As Jews, we must understand that there are some things that
we will never be able to understand (not even the wisest among us). For if we
had the ability to understand the exact underlying principles of all things,
then our whole system of belief would depend on our understanding of the
underlying principles. If we then came up against something that we could not
explain, then we would very possibly not accept it, and discard it ! So, accept
upon yourselves some commandment that you do not understand, and that you don't
see yourselves as ever possibly understanding. (I think that he said that the
wife said that she would accept upon herself the laws of family purity,
"taharas hamishpachah", the laws of "niddah". For a good book on the subject,
I'm told to read "The Waters of Eden", by Rabbi Aryeh Kaplan; published by
NCSY/UOJC.)

(3) You must understand that Judaism is not a religion based solely on man's
relationship with G-d. (This is called "bein adam lamakom".) An important tenet
of our faith is that the relationship between man & his fellow man also has high
priority. (This is called "bein adam lachaveiro".)

I understand Mr. Fine's comments to be related to point (3) above.

Asher Meth ....... meth@nyu-csd2.arpa ....... allegra!cmcl2!csd2!meth

meth@csd2.UUCP (Asher Meth) (01/30/86)

Andrew Jonathan Fine writes :
---------------------------------------------
I cannot claim to be Jewish even though I was born so, because I am not capable
of faith.  I do not intend to marry within the religion unless by accident, 
since I will not reduce the probability of being married by being overly
selective.  In terms of children, I would allow circumcision for the male baby
to allow it the option of being Jewish upon maturity. This is the way I have
reconciled myself.  I hope it helps.
---------------------------------------------

We have a specific verse in the Torah forbidding marrying out of the faith.
This verse appears in the portion of Va-eschanan, Devarim/Dueteronomy 7:3, as
"Lo sischatein bum", do not intermarry with them. It then explicates that "you
shall not give your daughter to his son, nor shall you take his daughter for
your son". The rabbis have learned many laws concerning our interactions with
non-Jews from this verse. There are prohibitions against certain kinds of
interactions for they may lead to our becoming *very* close with them,
ultimately (G-d forbid) to intermarriage.

>In terms of children, I would allow circumcision for the male baby
>to allow it the option of being Jewish upon maturity. 

I mentioned in a previous posting that "circumcision does not a Jew make". Your
statement "to allow it the option of being Jewish" is puzzling. Option? Choice?
Some choice! You have told us of the shoddy Jewish education you received, your
possibility of marrying within the faith as only an accidental possibility,
perhaps even remote, with the resultant non-emphasis on Judaism in the home
upbringing, and then, if at maturity the child decides that (s)he wishes to be
Jewish, so be it. Why, you have stacked the deck against Judaism !!! If your
Jewish education and personal leanings are any barometer, how will your child
have *any* chance of even knowing what it means to be Jewish. Oh, that's right,
to be Jewish means to be "required to attend synagogue, Hebrew school, and to
go to the barmitzvah ... no dissent on my part [being] allowed, and [being]
forced to do these things no matter if I liked it or not". Sorry, that is *not*
what it means to be Jewish, not where I came from, not where my father and
mother came from, not where their parents came from, ... , and that is not the
way that it was introduced to our patriarchs and matriarchs, and not how it was
given to our ancestors at Sinai. The heritage we received at Sinai was very
different from that which you describe. What you describe is the result of 
a distortion, concocted by those who wished to change the law to accomodate 
their own lifestyles.

It is taught that before G-d gave his Torah to the Jews, he first offered it to
the other nations of the world. Each asked, "What is written in it?", was given 
a response, and said, "Sorry, I can't do that; it will inhibit my lifestyle; I
don't want your Torah." What were those things that would inhibit their
lifestyles ? We can list some of them right out of the ten commandments (and I
quote from this week's portion, Yisro/Yitro, Shemos/Exodus 20:2-14) : 

   You shall not have other gods before me (but what about all my idols & other 
things that I worship?);
   Do not use G-d's name in vain (but how will I be able to cuss & curse?);
   Remember the day of my Sabbath (what? and what about *my* day off?);
   Honor your father & mother (but what if they don't want to let me do
anything that I want?); 
   Do not kill (but that is my profession - I'm a hit-man; and how will I be
able to exert my influence over others if not by force?);
   Do not commit adultery (what? no mistresses? what about free choice and 
freedom to choose sexual partners at any time & place?);
   Do not steal (but how will I be able to afford my extravagant lifestyle? how
else will I be able to terrorize my neighbors so that I can feed my drug
problem? how will I feed my family?);
   Do not bear false witness (what? no perjury? you mean I have to tell the
truth? but I have made my living out of lying, falsifying records, etc.);
   Do not covet your fellow man's house, wife, and possesions (but that is what
my life is all about!).

When G-d offered the Torah to the Jews, they responded, Shemos/Exodus 19:8,
"And the whole nation responded, as one, and they said, all that G-d speaks we
will do/fulfill". Dare we come along and repudiate the heritage of our
ancestors because it doesn't quite fit into our lifestyles, it is inconvenient,
etc. !! This is the reason that the other nations were unwilling to accept the
Torah in the first place. The Jewish way is to folow the teachings of G-d, as
passed down to us through our rabbis.

As others have mentioned in previous postings, Jewish law defines a Jew as one
who is born from a Jewish mother, or who is converted according to the
prescribed laws for conversion (again, if you want to play the game of becoming
Jewish, you have to play according to the rules). If the mother is not Jewish
according to the law, then her child is not Jewish. Then, even if the child
were raised a Jew (whatever that means in such a home where the mother is not
Jewish), to really be Jewish and marry within the Jewish faith (s)he would
require a conversion. This can cause problems with respect to marriage
partners; e.g., there are certain laws governing whom a kohein (of the priestly
family of Aaron) may marry - he may not marry a convert.

May I unequivocally state that *all* those people born Jewish, of mothers who
really are Jewish, are considered Jews, regardless of their level of practice
or of observance. Thus, a Jew who considers himself under the banner of
Conservative or Reform, is no less a Jew than the Jew who considers himself
under the banner of Orthodox. This is *not* the "beef" we Orthodox have. There
is no "second-class" classification being affixed upon *anyone* who *is*
Jewish. Our "beef" is that we refuse to permit the hallowed name of "Jew" to be
applied to a non-Jew. Thus, conversions must be performed as per the defined
rules & regulations. (They can be found in Shulchan Aruch/Codes, Yoreh Deah,
volume 3. The chapter numbers are not at my fingertips.) Other than proper
conversion, a person is a Jew *only* if his/her *mother* is Jewish. We do *not*
distinguish Jew from Jew, rather Jew from non-Jew. And any campaign to besmirch
our religion and to deny the above, even if it is Jews who are doing the
accusing, is nothing but a big, fat lie.

I suggest, Mr. Fine, (as Mr. Klahr suggested in response to your original
posting), that you you try to learn more about your (our) religion; increase
your Jewish Intelligence Quotient. Hopefuly you will find your niche in
Judaism, and come to appreciate all that our ancestors went through. I hope
that when you find your partner in life, religion *will* be a positive aspect
of your relationship.

Asher Meth ....... meth@nyu-csd2.arpa ....... allegra!cmcl2!csd2!meth

fsks@unc.UUCP (Frank Silbermann) (02/04/86)

In article <3780131@csd2.UUCP> meth@csd2.UUCP (Asher Meth) writes:
>
> Oh, that's right, to be Jewish means to be "required to attend synagogue,
>Hebrew school, and to go to the barmitzvah ... no dissent on my part [being]
>allowed, and [being] forced to do these things no matter if I liked it or not".
>Sorry, that is *not* what it means to be Jewish, not where I came from,
>not where my father and mother came from, not where their parents came from,
>... , and that is not the way that it was introduced to our patriarchs and
>matriarchs, and not how it was given to our ancestors at Sinai. The heritage
>we received at Sinai was very different from that which you describe. What you
>describe is the result of a distortion, concocted by those who wished to change
> the law to accomodate their own lifestyles.

Yes, but the kind of Judaism you disparage has become tradition,
and in Judaism, tradition soon acquires the force of Law.	:-)

>May I unequivocally state that *all* those people born Jewish, of mothers who
>really are Jewish, are considered Jews, regardless of their level of practice
>or of observance. Thus, a Jew who considers himself under the banner of
>Conservative or Reform, is no less a Jew than the Jew who considers himself
>under the banner of Orthodox.  This is *not* the "beef" we Orthodox have.

Agreed.  The real controversey is whether a Reform or Conservative rabbi
is really a rabbi.  Is a Conservative synogogue really a synogogue, or
merely a meeting place for Jewish heretics?

	Frank Silbermann