[net.veg] Is a dead bird the best way to show your appreciation????

devi@maisha.DEC (Gita L. Devi PKO1/D1 223-7046) (01/13/86)

How does a company express its appreciation of our services?  At 
Thanksgiving, Digital gives out dead turkeys!!!!  As an inveterate 
vegetarian, I've always been offended by the practice, especially on the 
evening of the "give-away", when I have to walk out of my building past 
large piles of cartons holding the poor birds' remains.  "Into the valley of 
the shadow of death..." ( I know that we live in a meat-based society so I
can't blame Digital for their method of appreciation)

BUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The fact that I have no say in the matter irks me.  A living creature has 
been killed IN MY NAME!  And the company response is that if you don't want 
the turkey, donate it to charity.  I don't want anyone to eat that turkey, 
so I tear up my "turkey card" knowing full well that the creature is still 
going to end up in someone's stomach.  

Over the past five years, I've often wondered who would be the appropriate 
person to talk with about this.  Well - a new group has been formed:

Affirmative Action/Valuing Differences, managed by Barbara Walker.  I've
written and spoken with Ms. Walker, and she agreed that the area/issue is 
very "provocative"..  She has forwarded my letter to the head of the turkey 
give-away committee.

Anyway - for you DECcies out there, please write to Ms. Walker and let her 
know how you feel about this matter.  She's on TURBO::WALKER.   And for 
those of you working for other companies, have you ever dealt with a 
situation like this?  I told Ms. Walker that I would rather get the money 
they spend for the bird, or that we should make it an option for all 
employees:  take the money or the turkey.

Any comments???

------------------------------

And - in answer to the question of why it's okay for animals to eat meat and 
not man:  Man has the option, the capacity to use higher reasoning and live 
by a morally higher standard.  Animals don't have those choices.  

I also agree:  why should it matter to someone who eats meat whether an 
animal is killed uselessly for food or for its fur, etc?  Can you really 
make a distinction where death is concerned (other than for self-defense)?

kdoshi@umn-cs.UUCP (Kunjal Doshi) (01/21/86)

> And - in answer to the question of why it's okay for animals to eat meat and 
> not man:  Man has the option, the capacity to use higher reasoning and live 
> by a morally higher standard.  Animals don't have those choices.  
> 
> I also agree:  why should it matter to someone who eats meat whether an 
> animal is killed uselessly for food or for its fur, etc?  Can you really 
> make a distinction where death is concerned (other than for self-defense)?

Couldn't have said it better myself. 

kd

tim@ism780c.UUCP (Tim Smith) (01/25/86)

> And - in answer to the question of why it's okay for animals to
> eat meat and not man: Man has the option, the capacity to use
> higher reasoning and live by a morally higher standard.  Animals
> don't have those choices.
>
> [ killing animals for food vs. killing animals for furs ]

All this argument really says is that it is ok for non-higher-reasoning
beings to eat meat because even if it is not moral to do so, they do
not have the capacity to decide this.   This argument says nothing about
the morality of eating meat.  And how about the morality of killing
plants? [ note: no :-) ]

I see no inconsistency in eating meat but objecting to having animals
killed for their fur.  There are other substances that can be used to
make fake furs that do not involve killing animals, and are just as
good or better than animal fur both functionally and esthetically (sp?).
When the technology of fake food gets to where, say, fake steaks and
hamburgers can be produced that are as good as the originals, both
nutritionally AND in taste/texture, then it will be time to stop
killing cattle.  Similarly for other meat animals.

Wouldn't net.misc be a better group for this?  I would assume that
most people who read net.veg are vegetarians, and so a more general
group, like net.misc, would be more likely to get no-vegetarians
involved.
-- 
Tim Smith       sdcrdcf!ism780c!tim || ima!ism780!tim || ihnp4!cithep!tim

tim@ism780c.UUCP (Tim Smith) (01/28/86)

In article <324@ism780c.UUCP> I make a type:
>
>Wouldn't net.misc be a better group for this?  I would assume that
>most people who read net.veg are vegetarians, and so a more general
>group, like net.misc, would be more likely to get no-vegetarians
>involved.

						    ^_ non-vegetarians
-- 
Tim Smith       sdcrdcf!ism780c!tim || ima!ism780!tim || ihnp4!cithep!tim

hsd@uvacs.UUCP (02/01/86)

Tim Smith writes:
> > [ killing animals for food vs. killing animals for furs ]
> the morality of eating meat.  And how about the morality of killing
> plants? [ note: no :-) ]
	This has always been a sore point with me. If I feel immoral by
	eating once-living, now-dead things, what makes plants any less
	"living" than animals? With the exception of eggs and milk, is
	there any current foodstuff which wasn't killed/harvested?

> I see no inconsistency in eating meat but objecting to having animals
> killed for their fur.  ...
	I agree. You are perfectly correct that modern technology can supply
	this need better than animals, and without causing pain and death.
  
> Wouldn't net.misc be a better group for this?  I would assume that
> most people who read net.veg are vegetarians, and so a more general
> group, like net.misc, would be more likely to get no-vegetarians
> involved.
	Here is at least one non-vegetarian who reads net.veg, because as
	a former veggie, I am still interested in these issues. I also
	have vegetarian friends whom I prepare meals for occasionally.
-- 
Harry S. Delugach   University of Virginia, Dept. of Computer Science
                    UUCP: ..!cbosgd!uvacs!hsd  or ..!decvax!mcnc!ncsu!uvacs!hsd
                    CSNET: hsd@virginia