king@glacier.ARPA (Robin King) (02/01/86)
Maybe some meat-eating maniac logged me off ;^) My point is that there are alot of different topics to talk about, other than just whether or not to eat meat, be it for your health or moral or religious reasons. For example, I'd appreciate knowing just haw to go about mixing dairy/legumes for a complete protein balance. Or, how does one politely ask one's host whether or not there is any lard (blech) in the crackers or chicken broth in the cream of celery soup? And why DO company dinners have to serve steak all the time? I mean, living this lifestyle causes day-to-day diffi- culties and adjustments that most average carnivores just would not comprehend. I'd say a fair number of them feel threatened that you're not "like them" and go out of their way to be insulting. If I hear "What's the difference between eating a cow and a carrot? They're both alive... " one more time I think I'll scream!! Someone tell me: why do they do this??????! So, why not talk about some other aspects of "vegetarianism" than just the decision to become one? I've been in my current mode for about 12 years and would like to hear from others with similar interests. Let's keep the tone lighthearted. Robin King PS- I eat fish beacuse I don't think they have a well developed nervous system and won't feel much pain or know what's happening. I draw the line at warm-blooded critters. So flame me if you want to.
leimkuhl@uiucdcsp.CS.UIUC.EDU (02/04/86)
Robin- I agree with you %100. There are much more fundamental points to talk about. Most veggies spend there whole lives defending their practice, and it's nice to get a chance to talk about food without getting in an argument. As for protein balance, the first rule of thumb is to ignore most of the old concepts of minimum protein. You really don't need all that much. If you drink milk with meals, eat yogurt, cheese, and eggs and peanut butter, as well as balanced bean and grain creations occasionally you can be quite lackadaisical about balancing proteins. This is the word from several vegetarian doctors here at the UI (every time I tell a doctor I'm a vegetarian, I find that he is too!). Very important for you, because you are a woman, is that you get enough iron. You almost have to take a supplement unless you are working very hard to get enough by eating spinach, etc. Men don't lose their stores of iron each month, so it is less of a problem. Finally, there is the B-vitamin problem. The only way the veggie gets B-12 in a normal diet (excluding plankton eaters) is through eggs. If you've asked around at all, you'll know that eggs are on the "bad" list with doctors these days: I heard that 4 maximum/week is sensible. The thing about B-12 is that your body stores about 1-2000mcg (mostly in the digestive tract) as you stop replacing these stores, you can eventually lose it. This process takes 2-5 years, so it may be too late by the time you find it--and that can be quite serious. If you take antibiotics, you can wipe out your supply much faster since they tend to destroy B-12 along with other organisms. My advice: take a B-complex supplement every now and then (say once or twice a week) just to keep the supply up, more when you're on antibiotics. Since your body absorbs and stores it, you probably don't need to take it every day. My supplement is 12mcg--about 6 times the RDA--anyway. Now what am I not getting that I don't know about? -Ben Leimkuhler
avinash@ubvax.UUCP (Avinash Marathe) (02/07/86)
In article <17700010@uiucdcsp> leimkuhl@uiucdcsp.CS.UIUC.EDU writes: > > Finally, there is the B-vitamin problem. The only way the veggie >gets B-12 in a normal diet (excluding plankton eaters) is through >eggs..... > > Now what am I not getting that I don't know about? > >-Ben Leimkuhler Not entirely true. You can get B-12 from fermented soybean products such as tempeh and miso. In fact tempeh is high in B-12. To find out more about these foods read the books by William Shurtleff (sp?) called "The Book of Tempeh" and "The Book of Miso". Seaweed also contains B-12 and is quite delicious if you can get used to it. For those of you who do eat dairy foods and eggs, these are also sources of B-12. Avinash Marathe {ihnp4,allegra,decwrl}!amd!ubvax!avinash
guy@slu70.UUCP (Guy M. Smith) (02/07/86)
In article <17700010@uiucdcsp>, leimkuhl@uiucdcsp.CS.UIUC.EDU writes: > > If you've asked around at all, you'll know that eggs are on the > "bad" list with doctors these days: I heard that 4 maximum/week is > sensible. I see this figure tossed around a lot but is it really relevant to a vegetarian diet. My impression is that this limit was proposed for a 'typical' American diet with large mounts of saturated fats coming from red meat. If you eliminate the meat can you up your egg quota?
leimkuhl@uiucdcsp.CS.UIUC.EDU (02/10/86)
Well, my impression is that the cholestoral in eggs is the real problem-- we're not talking saturated fats here, we're talking levels of serum cholestoral in the bloodstream. During the Vietnam war, many medical experiments were conducted on American casualties (war presents a rare opportunity to conduct autopsies on the bodies of large numbers of young men). One of these studied levels of serum cholestoral and blockage of the arteries surrounding the heart--they found extreme constriction. Perhaps, though, if you're not eating meat, there is just not as much fat to be deposited, but the person who quoted me four eggs per week was a vegetarian herself, as well as an RN. -Ben Leimkuhler
leimkuhl@uiucdcsp.CS.UIUC.EDU (02/10/86)
Yes, you are correct. But here in Illinois, such things are rather exotic--at least I'm not willing to hunt them down and prepare them.