prophet@umcp-cs.UUCP (Dennis Gibbs) (09/21/84)
<>
A few months ago, Sears had a sale on their new 60-month battery (NOT Die-Hard)
and so I decided to go ahead and replace the battery in my 1979 Datsun 310GX.
The battery in my Datsun that I was replacing was the original equipment
battery (over five years old). This original equipment battery was a GREAT
battery, it had survived a couple of winters where the temperature would dip as
low as -10 degrees Fahrenheit. The battery was still working fine, since the
weather was warm, but I was afraid that it would not survive a sixth winter of
below zero termperature. Since Sears was having a sale, I decided to go for it.
Anyway, I took the car to Sears, and bought the battery. They pulled the car
into the service facility, where I tried to watch the mechanic from the lounge
as best I could. (Sears will not allow customers to enter the sevice areas). I
saw the mechanic put in my battery, and then he proceded to test the electrical
system. I knew something was wrong when I saw him start the engine, take a
reading from the meter, and then, stopping the engine, he proceded to tighten
the alternator drive belt. Then, after starting the engine again and taking
another reading, he called in the service manager.
At this point, the service manager began heading for the customer lounge, and I
thought, oh no, they're going to try to hit me for a new alternator. Sure
enough, the manager came in, and said, " Your alternator is not putting out
enough current, you're going to have to replace it." Being a former mechanic
myself, and taking careful care of my car, I knew the service manager was wrong.
Besides, the manager's phrase "not putting out enough current" is erroneous,
because an alternator's competence is measured by its output in volts, which
is not current (amps). I told the manager this, and he said that most cars put
out about 20 amps, whereas mine was putting out only 10. This is ridiculous,
because the current in the circuit depends almost entirely upon the state of
charge of the battery. I told the manager to just finish installing the batt-
ery and I would be on my way.
When I got home, I ran a thorough check of the electrical system, and found
nothing wrong. Three months later, the car is running fine, and the battery is
holding its charge perfectly.
On a separate incident, my brother took his 1974 Capri into Sears to have a new
water pump installed. Naturally, to put on the pump, they had to remove t
he hoses from the pump, thus draining the radiator. When my brother's wife
came to pick up the car, she paid the bill, and then drove off. After a couple
of blocks, the car overheated! It turns out they "forgot" to replace the fluid
in the radiator!!! My brother raised so much hell with Sears that they gave
him a free 24 month, 24000 mile warranty on the engine in case anything went
wrong as a result of their mistake.
My conclusion? I'm not going near a Sears "mechanic" except as an absolute lastresort.
Dennis
--
Call-Me: Dennis Gibbs, Univ. of Md. Comp. Sci. Center.
UUCP: {seismo,allegra,brl-bmd}!umcp-cs!prophet
CSNet: prophet@umcp-cs
BITNET: GIBBS@UMDB
ARPA: prophet@Marylandron@brl-tgr.ARPA (Ron Natalie <ron>) (09/22/84)
Stay away from Firestone dealers. The mechanics job there is to sell not to repair. I had a friend
essachs@ihuxl.UUCP (Ed Sachs) (09/24/84)
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What makes you think that the kids (and I do mean kids, 90% of them are under 21) who work at Sears auto centers (or Firestone, or whatever) are "mechnics." These places pay very low wages to inexperienced incompetents. When they learn their jobs well enough to consider being real "mechanics," they find better paying jobs elsewhere. -- Ed Sachs AT&T Bell Laboratories Naperville, IL ihnp4!ihuxl!essachs
bmt@we53.UUCP ( B. M. Thomas ) (09/25/84)
I have gotten the better of the Sears battery warranty. Some years ago, I had a problem with (I discovered later) a bad connection to my (Ford) starter relay. Before I did discover it, I had destroyed: a starter; a starter relay; an ignition coil; my old battery; and a brand-new SEARS battery. I knew that I had killed the new battery because after I found and fixed the electrical problem, it could be completely discharged in 30 minutes by the tape player which was fused at 2 amps, also recharged from "no chance" to "quick start" in 10 minutes with a 6-amp charger--1 amp-hour! Playing dumb, I took the car in and said that I thought their battery was no good. Now, I knew that if they found anything wrong with the electrical system, they would say, first fix that(or have us do it, we'd be glad to), then we'll honor the warranty. Fifteen minutes later, they came back. I asked about the battery, and they said I had a new one now, no charge. Ha! It does pay to know what you're doing. from over the rainbow of we53!bmt(Brian M. Thomas @ AT&T Technologies, St. Louis, MO)
scott@opus.UUCP (Scott Wiesner) (09/28/84)
> I have gotten the better of the Sears battery warranty. > > Playing dumb, I took the car in and said that I thought their battery was no > good. Now, I knew that if they found anything wrong with the electrical > system, they would say, first fix that(or have us do it, we'd be glad to), > then we'll honor the warranty. Fifteen minutes later, they came back. > I asked about the battery, and they said I had a new one now, no charge. Ha! > > It does pay to know what you're doing. Who did it pay? You've still got some money in your pocket and can be "proud" that you've ripped off the big company, or did you? Quick, everyone run out and see if you can con some salesman or mechanic. Certainly you're in the right as long as you don't get caught. I'll remember you the next time I try to figure out why things cost so much. -- Scott Wiesner {allegra, ucbvax, cornell}!nbires!scott
bmt@we53.UUCP ( B. M. Thomas ) (10/02/84)
Ugh! I might have taken offense, but rereading my article, I suppose there was a (not altogether unintended) larcenous tone to it. The point was not that I felt that I had ripped them off, since I would not have done such a thing. The point was that their warranty completely avoids any discussion of fault, and is a means, not entirely dishonest and perhaps not even unethical, of getting more service business. The ploy is based on the typical customer's ignorance of matters automotive and electrical. What I defeated was this assumption of ignorance. There was no fraud involved, in spite of my somewhat sneaky feeling about the whole thing. As I said, if they found anything wrong with my electrical system, they would not even insist upon my letting them repair it, indeed legally they cannot, but since I was there anyway, they simply play the percentages, and it's a good game. Then, after they, or I, or whoever, repaired the system, they would have honored the warranty anyway, no questions asked. I think it's a good arrangement, and who pays for it is the person who is ignorant enough to think that a battery has failed when the electrical system was at fault. The fact is that they seldom have to replace a battery under the terms of the warranty, since most people, faced with a car that won't start, think first of the battery. Well, of course the battery IS usually discharged, but more often than not it is still serviceable, but the electrical system will not keep it charged. Replacing the battery is the obvious remedy, but is not a lasting cure. When the battery is again discharged, they look to this blanket warranty to save them, but the mechanics will not honor the warranty until all other problems have been rectified. I wouldn't either. In fact, I will state categorically that I can make an inferior battery outlast most battery warranties, and if it goes dead, it would usually be my negligence that caused it. Keeping the car's electrical system in shape is the most important matter here. No battery can long withstand the abuse that even the average motorist gives it, and simple routine maintenance can prolong its life indefinitely. What causes batteries to go dead is using them. More precisely, using them to their limits. An average, even very good, battery can withstand about four or five deep discharges, and then it's dead. The solution: don't do that! Keeping the engine tuned is a key here. An engine that starts quickly obviously loads the battery less. Another item is keeping alternator belts properly tightened. Don't guess how much deflection you can put in the belt or anything like that, we are not really after tension but torque. My rule of thumb is if you can turn the alternator without the belts turning the engine, it's too loose. Anyway... I hope that no one else misconstrued my meaning in that article. I disapprove of consumer fraud even when practiced by the consumer. What I was gloating over was that I beat the system that takes advantage of the average person's ignorance and importunity in order to gain more business, simply by not being ignorant, and getting off my butt enough to know what was really wrong with my car. As I mentioned, it cost me enough figuring out what it was that was going wrong, and I am not exactly proud of how long THAT took. Sorry this article is so long, I didn't have time to write a shorter one. from over the rainbow of we53!bmt(Brian M. Thomas @ AT&T Technologies, St. Louis, MO)