cas@cvl.UUCP (Cliff Shaffer) (10/08/85)
Recently in the Washington Post Magazine and through direct-junk-mail, I have seen ads for the "MALIN M-15 Survival Knife." They sell for $5 plus $2 shipping/handling per knife. They have a compass in the butt of the handle, a bunch of things like fish hooks and a cable saw in the (hollow) handle, a sheathe and a sharpening stone. The blade is made of "420 molecular stainless" whatever that is. I have seen what LOOK like identical knives in either the REI or EMS cataloge (I forget which) for just under $40. The ad claims that it is an advertising campaign - you have probably seen the type. Does anyone know anything about this (beyond having seen the ad)? My cataloge does not use the name "MALIN M-15"; has anyone heard of it? The most suspicious thing is the name and address of the company. It is "A & C" at a PO box in Hicksville, New York. I think that this is another reincarnation of the infamous Abernathy & however, alias Gem Collectors International, alias Cheeselovers International (or some such) alias whoever it was who I bought a super-cheap "UDS computer telephone" from a few years ago. There was a discussion about them in net.consumers a year or so ago. They are usually a junk dealer; worse than that, I had to threaten them with the postal authorities before they would come up with the phone. Cliff Shaffer ...cvl!cas
andrew@grkermi.UUCP (Andrew W. Rogers) (10/09/85)
In article <858@cvl.UUCP> cas@cvl.UUCP (Cliff Shaffer) writes: >Recently in the Washington Post Magazine and through direct-junk-mail, >I have seen ads for the "MALIN M-15 Survival Knife." >They sell for $5 plus $2 shipping/handling per knife... [description] >I have seen what LOOK like identical knives in either the REI or EMS cataloge >(I forget which) for just under $40. Remember the adage, "You get what you pay for"? >The ad claims that it is an advertising campaign - you have probably seen >the type. Sure have. As you correctly surmise (below), this is good ol' Abernathy & Closther at it again. Remember when they advertised a "genuine .10 point diamond [some piece of jewelry]" for a similar price? .10 point is 1/1000 carat, i.e. about the size of a grain of sand! I bet the "420 molecular" (I don't know what that means either) turns out to be a similar deception. >Does anyone know anything about this (beyond having seen the ad)? Nothing specific about the knife itself, but considering the reputation of A & C I'd pass. >My catalog does not use the name "MALIN M-15"; has anyone heard of it? I doubt that anyone other than A & C has heard of it. My guess is that it's a cheapo knockoff, probably more for "Rambo" fans than serious outdoorsmen. >The most suspicious thing is the name and address of the company. >It is "A & C" at a PO box in Hicksville, New York. >I think that this is another reincarnation of the infamous >Abernathy & however, alias Gem Collectors International, alias >Cheeselovers International (or some such) alias whoever it was >who I bought a super-cheap "UDS computer telephone" from a few years ago. You got it! >There was a discussion about them in net.consumers a year or so ago. >They are usually a junk dealer; worse than that, I had to threaten them >with the postal authorities before they would come up with the phone. It's your money... go ahead and send 'em some more! Seriously - why do you think they operate under so many aliases? AWR (ex-Cheeselover) PS: A few years ago, Gem Collectors Intl. send me a flyer offering me a "free" gem (sorry, I don't remember the description) - probably to get my name for a mailing list. I bit, and the "gem" I received was about as attractive as a piece of rock salt!
gbr@mb2c.UUCP (Jerry Ruhno) (10/09/85)
> Recently in the Washington Post Magazine and through direct-junk-mail, > I have seen ads for the "MALIN M-15 Survival Knife." > They sell for $5 plus $2 shipping/handling per knife. > They have a compass in the butt of the handle, > a bunch of things like fish hooks and a cable saw in the (hollow) handle, > a sheathe and a sharpening stone. > The blade is made of "420 molecular stainless" whatever that is. > I have seen what LOOK like identical knives in either the REI or EMS cataloge > (I forget which) for just under $40. > > Does anyone know anything about this (beyond having seen the ad)? > My cataloge does not use the name "MALIN M-15"; has anyone heard of it? I always rely on 2 famous quotes: "You get what you pay for" & "If it is too good to be true, it probably is"
wmartin@brl-tgr.ARPA (Will Martin ) (10/09/85)
In article <858@cvl.UUCP> cas@cvl.UUCP (Cliff Shaffer) writes: >Recently in the Washington Post Magazine and through direct-junk-mail, >I have seen ads for the "MALIN M-15 Survival Knife." >They sell for $5 plus $2 shipping/handling per knife. Ah, a topic that I am a bona-fide expert in... I deal in knives on a part-time basis, not to make any money at it but to buy stuff for my collection at wholesale. These particular survival knives (defining the term as a knife with a hollow handle you can keep matches, fishhooks, line, etc. in) are made in Taiwan, and are not a bad deal for the price. And, for a change, this mail-order campaign, selling them at $7 each, is really dealing at a fair price. My normal wholesale source for these had them at $10 each originally, and then dropped the price to $7 "on sale", where they have been on perpetual sale ever since. (That is a quantity-one wholesale rate.) These very same knives have been offered for $20 or so via numerous ads, both full-page and tiny, in many gun, survivalist, and outdoors magazines. They were available there also in a camouflage finish, which these "Malin" ads do not mention, so that is the main difference. Note the use of "Malin", an obvious play on "Marlin", an old-line name in the gun and outdoors-goods trade. These are not fancy, and the blade steel is not of great quality, but they do cut, and the compass works, and the stuff in the handle is functional. The main defect in these, as with any other hollow-handle survival knife, is the blade-handle joint. To get a hollow handle, you can't have much of a tang on the blade, and it is usually just epoxied in the handle on cheap knives. To get a more solid assembly, you go up in price to a $100 Buckmaster or a $250 handmade custom version. If you want to be able to use a knife as a pry bar and not have it break, you have to have a solid-tang model where the tang extends the full length of the handle. So you give up the storage compartment for strength. So, in general conclusion, they are probably worth the money, unless these mass-sales models are distinctly different and inferior to the Taiwanese models I have already seen. That seems unlikely -- I think they just bought a vast quantity and got a good price. You should expect to spend some time with a good stone or sharpening kit (like a Lansky or E-Z-Sharp) putting a decent edge on this knife after you get it. The factory cannot take the time to do much of a honing job at the prices they are getting! For a knife to throw in your car trunk as insurance against the time you might need it, it is worth it. I am giving one of mine to a friend this Christmas for just that purpose. Regards, Will
wmartin@brl-tgr.ARPA (Will Martin ) (10/09/85)
A couple points I forgot in the first response: Yes, the sellers are the infamous junk merchants of great ill-repute. We have bought some of their cheap watches in the past, and gotten what we paid for, but I understand they have cheated others. So buyer beware. As for the look-alike knives you've seen in other catalogs: the Life-Knife people have been selling these for some years now. They do have similar knives, but they have better quality control and stand behind their products. Wholesale prices on Life-Knife models are in the $20-$25 range. They also sell replacements and add-ons for the survival kit items, if you can't find the stuff locally. Most of the middle range of knives these days are made in Japan; Taiwan products are usually a grade below these. The Japanese products are not bad, and usually offer good value for money (if you don't pay list price). Will
wmartin@brl-tgr.ARPA (Will Martin ) (10/11/85)
And yet another point I forgot to include: The "saw-teeth" on the back of these Taiwanese knives are worthless, merely "decorative". They have no sharpness at all. (They might work as fish scalers, though -- just thought of that.) This model knife does, however, come with a wire saw and two split rings (like keyrings) to use as handles on the saw. This will work better than the saw teeth on the back of most "Rambo"-style survival knives, even much more expensive ones. The problem with sawteeth on a knifeblade back is that the teeth have no offset, so they can't work like a real wood saw functions, with the sawblade being narrower than the kerf. These teeth are shaped like: _____ _____ |/|/|/|/|/|/|/|/|/ Most fancier survival knives have square-cut teeth, with the top either a sharp edge or a flat-cut block, but the cuts are clean and make a sharp right-angle edge on their sides. These are like: _____ __ __ __ __ _____ |_| |_| |_| |_| |_| The other style of teeth on the back of a survival knife blade are triangular, like this: _____ ______ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ (The points should come up to the line of the blade back.) These are originally designed as aircrew survival knives, and this form of teeth really does work in cutting through the thin aluminum skin of a helicopter or light aircraft (so you can hack yourself an escape hatch before the beast blows up). They're not much good on wood, though. Yet another kind has alternating right and left-pointing triangular teeth, cut into the blade from the top. (I don't think I can ASCII-draw that.) These work better than most others, but are also more expensive to make, and still clog with cuttings on wood. Some of the old WWI-era "engineer" bayonets had teeth like that; I have a Swiss 1889 or 1911 model with beautiful teeth -- such work would probably cost $500 nowadays... Will
larry@kitty.UUCP (Larry Lippman) (10/24/85)
> Recently in the Washington Post Magazine and through direct-junk-mail, > I have seen ads for the "MALIN M-15 Survival Knife." > ... > The ad claims that it is an advertising campaign - you have probably seen > the type. > > Does anyone know anything about this (beyond having seen the ad)? > My cataloge does not use the name "MALIN M-15"; has anyone heard of it? > The most suspicious thing is the name and address of the company. > It is "A & C" at a PO box in Hicksville, New York. > I think that this is another reincarnation of the infamous > Abernathy & however, alias Gem Collectors International, alias > Cheeselovers International (or some such) alias whoever it was > who I bought a super-cheap "UDS computer telephone" from a few years ago. > There was a discussion about them in net.consumers a year or so ago. > They are usually a junk dealer; worse than that, I had to threaten them > with the postal authorities before they would come up with the phone. >>> RIPOFF WARNING <<< This firm is the infamous Abernathy & Closther, a/k/a Carter & Van Peel, a/k/a E.M.P. Sales, a/k/a Marine Surplus Depot, a/k/a Romar Sales, a/k/a ad nauseam. There was a recent "Fight Back" TV show segment on one of their fine quality diamond inlaid watches. This outfit is notorious for naming products such that they sound similar to legitimate ones. `Malin" is probably supposed to stand for `Marlin'. My favorite name was when they were selling 35mm cameras for $ 5.00. I had to read the name `Yahama' at least five times before I realized that it was NOT `Yamaha'. They also think they are clever in defeating fradulent advertising laws when they say a product is `Nationally Advertised', because they claim that `Nationally Advertised' is a *trademark* and not a literal statetement. Any `merchandise' which they have to sell is, to put it bluntly, pure shit. I must say, I do enjoy reading their ads literally. My favorite line is when they described as a *feature* that their `mini-binoculars' have lenses which are `non-prismatic' and `unbreakable plastic'. Gee, if only Zeiss offered those features... Does anyone remember the $ 39.00 `mini-motorboat'? This ripoff company hides under a number of names, addresses, and post offices boxes, none of which has an obvious telephone. HOWEVER, there IS a telephone number for the `parent' operation, E.M.P. Sales of 535 Fifth Avenue, New York, N. Y., which is 212/682-1540. Call 'em up and tell 'em that you won't fall for their advertisements! Better yet, call collect! This outfit is a cancer and should be eradicated from the face of the earth. === Larry Lippman @ Recognition Research Corp., Clarence, New York === === UUCP {decvax,dual,rocksanne,rocksvax,watmath}!sunybcs!kitty!larry === === VOICE 716/741-9185 {rice,shell}!baylor!/ === === FAX 716/741-9635 {AT&T 3510D} syr!buf!/ === === TELEX 69-71461 ansbak: ELGECOMCLR {via WUI} ihnp4!/ === === === === "Have you hugged your cat today?" ===
mike@amdcad.UUCP (Mike Parker) (11/01/85)
Just my 2 bits worth on the "Malin M-15" debate. 1 bit: Harbor Freight Salvage who, I have had pleasant experiences with in the past is selling a knife that looks exactly like the one in the Malin ads, for $3.95. HFS is a good company and generally gives you things at half what they're worth, but I wouldn't want a knife that was worth $7.90 even for only $3.95. It just has to be a piece of shit. 2 bit: They were selling the same knife on telephone action ( the one thing that makes me most embarrased to say I'm from San Jose ) I like to watch it because the announcer is such a critter. Anyway, i've always wondered hoe their prices compare. Everything they sell is off-brand so can't be compared, so you say, how much the Malin knife? "Every hand that goes up, every call that comes in, just $9.95" And they didn't bother to bid it up to $30 before doing the world this big favor. Mike