[net.games.go] Answer: Live & Death problem #8.

bill@dual.UUCP (Bill Kanawyer) (04/17/84)

< joseki for bugs >

    Here black is to play first and try to kill white.
    Can he do it?
    How?

	A  B  C  D  E  F  G  H  J  K
   10   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  3  2  1
    9   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  O
    8   .  .  .  O  .  O  O  @  O  .
    7   *  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  .  O
    6   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  O  O
    5   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  @  @
    4   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
    3   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
    2   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
    1   *  .  .  .  .  .  *  .  .  .

Black = @  White = O  Answer moves = 1, 2, 3, ...
=========================================

    The best that black can do here is to force a ko on white. After black
plays 3) H-10 white cannot fill at K-10. White must therefor kill the black
stones by playing at G-9,10. As you can see this is a two step ko for white.

    Black can be happy knowing that, even if he looses the ko, he has made
the best use of his 'dead' stones. Remember 'losing' the ko means 2 moves in
a row someplace else.

Bill Kanawyer
{ucbvax,amd70,ihnp4,cbosgd,decwrl,fortune,zehntel}!dual!bill

hoj909@hou2f.UUCP (C.BOHRINGER) (04/20/84)

<     Here black is to play first and try to kill white.
<     Can he do it?
<     How?
< 
< 	A  B  C  D  E  F  G  H  J  K
<    10   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  3  2  1
<     9   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  O
<     8   .  .  .  O  .  O  O  @  O  .
<     7   *  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  .  O
<     6   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  O  O
<     5   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  @  @
<     4   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<     3   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<     2   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<     1   *  .  .  .  .  .  *  .  .  .
< 
< Black = @  White = O  Answer moves = 1, 2, 3, ...
< =========================================
< 
<     The best that black can do here is to force a ko on white. After black
< plays 3) H-10 white cannot fill at K-10. White must therefor kill the black
< stones by playing at G-9,10. As you can see this is a two step ko for white.
< 
<     Black can be happy knowing that, even if he looses the ko, he has made
< the best use of his 'dead' stones. Remember 'losing' the ko means 2 moves in
< a row someplace else.

Why can't black, after 4) G-9, continue with 5) K-10 taking J-10,
after 6) G-10 play 7) K-8 taking K-9 resulting in

	A  B  C  D  E  F  G  H  J  K
   10   .  .  .  .  .  .  O  @  .  @
    9   .  .  .  .  .  .  O  @  @  .
    8   .  .  .  O  .  O  O  @  O  @
    7   *  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  .  O
    6   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  O  O
    5   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  @  @
    4   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
    3   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
    2   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
    1   *  .  .  .  .  .  *  .  .  . ,

and kill white in the next move with 9) J-7 ?

                                        Christian Bohringer

bill@dual.UUCP (04/24/84)

<<     Here black is to play first and try to kill white.
<<     Can he do it? How?
<< 
<< 	A  B  C  D  E  F  G  H  J  K
<<    10   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  3  2  1
<<     9   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  O
<<     8   .  .  .  O  .  O  O  @  O  .
<<     7   *  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  .  O
<<     6   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  O  O
<<     5   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  @  @
<<     4   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<<     3   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<<     2   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<<     1   *  .  .  .  .  .  *  .  .  .
<< 
<< Black = @  White = O  Answer moves = 1, 2, 3, ...
<< =========================================
<< 
<<     The best that black can do here is to force a ko on white. After black
<< plays 3) H-10 white cannot fill at K-10. White must therefor kill the black
<< stones by playing at G-9,10. As you can see this is a two step ko for white.
<< 
<<     Black can be happy knowing that, even if he looses the ko, he has made
<< the best use of his 'dead' stones. Remember 'losing' the ko means 2 moves in
<< a row someplace else.

< Why can't black, after 4) G-9, continue with 5) K-10 taking J-10,
< after 6) G-10 play 7) K-8 taking K-9 resulting in
< 
< 	A  B  C  D  E  F  G  H  J  K
<    10   .  .  .  .  .  .  O  @  .  @
<     9   .  .  .  .  .  .  O  @  @  .
<     8   .  .  .  O  .  O  O  @  O  @
<     7   *  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  .  O
<     6   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  O  O  O
<     5   .  .  .  .  .  .  @  @  @  @
<     4   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<     3   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<     2   .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
<     1   *  .  .  .  .  .  *  .  .  . ,
< 
< and kill white in the next move with 9) J-7 ?
< 
<  Christian Bohringer

    What!
    White give up without a struggle!
    Where is your fighting spirit?

    Take another look...

    After black takes the stone at J-10 (ko) white will make a ko threat
somewhere else on the board. If the threat is small (less then about 20 
points) black will take the next stone at K-9. But if the threat is large
(greater then say 25-30 points) black will answer and allow white to retake
the ko. Thus is a ko fight born.

    Is this clear to everyone? If not or if I am full of hot air let me know.

Bill Kanawyer
{ucbvax,amd70,ihnp4,cbosgd,decwrl,fortune,zehntel}!dual!bill