geoff@desint.UUCP (Geoff Kuenning) (11/12/84)
I am not generally in favor of deceiving one's children. Indeed, I place a lot of value on dealing straightly, and have found this to be a successful approach. But a friend of mine learned a little trick that is certainly very useful, and seems to me to be a fairly harmless lie. You simply teach your kid (it helps to start very young) that they only grow when they are asleep. This makes bedtimes much easier; you simply point out that they need to sleep to grow big and strong so they can do all those grown-up things they want to do. In some sense, this is even true; I just put a lot more emphasis on the growth part and less on the health part. -- Geoff Kuenning First Systems Corporation ...!ihnp4!trwrb!desint!geoff
allenm@ittvax.UUCP (Allen Matsumoto) (11/12/84)
> I am not generally in favor of deceiving one's children. > Indeed, I place a lot of value on dealing straightly, and > have found this to be a successful approach. But a friend > of mine learned a little trick that is certainly very > useful, and seems to me to be a fairly harmless lie. You > simply teach your kid (it helps to start very young) that > they only grow when they are asleep. This makes bedtimes > much easier; you simply point out that they need to sleep to > grow big and strong so they can do all those grown-up things > they want to do. In some sense, this is even true; I just > put a lot more emphasis on the growth part and less on the > health part. -- > > Geoff Kuenning > First Systems Corporation > ...!ihnp4!trwrb!desint!geoff I don't like this approach at all. As either a general or a specific solution. I don't believe in trying to deceive my children. I do occasionally slip up and pull a "fast one", but I don't plan on tricking them. It may be a "fairly harmless lie", but do you need any sort of lie to get kids to sleep? I think that if you have a real reason for something, such as getting the kids abed by some hour, you can explain it to them in a manner they understand. Our general reason is so they won't be tired and grouchy the next day. "If you don't get enough sleep, you'll be tired and grouchy tomorrow and you'll just get in trouble. That won't be any fun so just go to bed and get some rest." What's wrong with "We try to get to bed as close to __ o'clock as possible." At our house, bedtime is 8 to 8:30, except for negotiable excuses. Our kids are 8, 4, and 1. (The 1 year old goes to bed when she is obviously tired, which varies from about 7 to about 9.) This may be autocratic, but you're not lying to them. I wouldn't want my kids to learn I've consciously lied. (I even pay for their admissions to things when they become old enough to miss the "free for 5 and under" type limits. They know how old they are, even if you fool the ticket sellers) As a SPECIFIC problem, I really wouldn't deceive kids about going to sleep. For one thing, I don't think anyone knows why people need sleep. If it's for growth, why not sleep 20 hours a day? Why don't adults continue growing? What happends when your kids can't fall asleep? Do you want them to worry about not growing? What about MENTAL growth? I think a lot of mental growth occurs when you are awake. Do you really want to tell your kids you want them to grow big but soporific? I think most of us can remember lying awake with great thoughts in our heads keeping us awake (or they seemed like great thoughts at the time). If you want a technique for getting them in bed, try convincing them that you really want them in bed, and you'll keep putting them in bed, and that it's no fun to stay up after bedtime. If it's too dark, put on the hall light. If they are scared, stay for a while and tell them a story or sing them a song. If they scream and shout, tell them you'll close the door if they can't keep from disturbing others. These kinds of things usually work, unless your primary motive is to get them in bed so you can get to something you yourself want. When we have people over and want the kids quiet for ourselves, we'll try other tricks. Letting them sleep in our bed often works. Most of our kids' complaints can be addressed with some means which ALSO keeps them in bed. That tends to take more time than tying them to their beds, either with rope or tricks, but I happen to think it will be worth it in the long run. I know it's trite, but "kids are people, too." -- Allen Matsumoto ITT Adv. Tech. Center, Stratford, CT 06497 203-385-7218 (decvax!ittvax!allenm)
jug@whuxlm.UUCP (Grauman Joseph) (11/27/84)
> I am not generally in favor of deceiving one's children. Indeed, I place a > lot of value on dealing straightly, and have found this to be a successful > approach. But a friend of mine learned a little trick that is certainly very > useful, and seems to me to be a fairly harmless lie. You simply teach your > kid (it helps to start very young) that they only grow when they are asleep. > This makes bedtimes much easier; you simply point out that they need to > sleep to grow big and strong so they can do all those grown-up things they > want to do. In some sense, this is even true; I just put a lot more > emphasis on the growth part and less on the health part. > -- > > Geoff Kuenning > First Systems Corporation > ...!ihnp4!trwrb!desint!geoff [A few bytes for the bit cruncher] I totally disagree with the concept of deceiving one's, or for that matter, someone else's children, in order to get them to do something. There's no need to deceive if you do things the right way from the beginning. Having to characterize a deception as being useful is just a way to rationalize a screw-up by the parents which created the undesirable mode of behavior in their kids. We have never had any problems with our kids going to sleep at bedtime for the following reasons: 1. When kids are tired they really want to sleep. 2. We never made their bedroom an undesirable place, i.e., we have never threatened to send them to their bedroom as punishment when they mis- behaved, nor do we threaten and use early bedtime for unrelated misbehavior. 3. They're not worried about missing something while they're asleep since we have developed a relationship built on mutual trust, and we share with each other stories about events that are of interest and which occur when not everyone is present. Another popular area of 'useful' deception is mealtime and trying to get kids to eat. This would probably generate a lively discussion in net.kids. In general, an honest and up-front relationship with kids goes a lot further than one based on so-called 'useful' deceptions. That has been our experience, and it works!