robbin@spp3.UUCP (01/15/85)
[]
We have an 8 1/2 month old. Until about two weeks ago we were holding his
bottle and rocking him to sleep in our arms. We were told that it is a very
bad habit to get you child into and that he should be going to sleep in his
crib by himself. We were then given the advise of putting him in his crib
with the bottle propped to wean him from having to hold him.
The problem has been that he seems to cry more and does not go to sleep as
easily as he use to when we held him.
I would appreciate any suggestion, or replies of what has worked or
not worked for anyone.
Our intention is eventually to get him to go to sleep by himself but it
there any easy transition, or at what age does it seem best to start?
Thanks in advance.
Robbin Brahms
{ucbvax,decvax}!trwrb!trwspp!spp2!spp1!spp3!robbindwl10@amdahl.UUCP (Dave Lowrey) (01/16/85)
> [] > We have an 8 1/2 month old. Until about two weeks ago we were holding his > bottle and rocking him to sleep in our arms. We were told that it is a very > bad habit to get you child into and that he should be going to sleep in his > crib by himself. We were then given the advise of putting him in his crib > with the bottle propped to wean him from having to hold him. > What ever you do, DONT PUT HIM IN BED WITH A BOTTLE!!! There are many medical reasons for not doing this. One, is that the kid could choke. Formula can spill out of his mouth and get into his ears causing ear infections (as if kids don't get enough anyways). Also, it will make weaning him of the bottle that much harder. An 8 1/2 month old child should be on a schedule of sorts. he should go to bed at the same time every night, and take naps at about the same time every day. You should attempt to feed him at the same time every day. After a while, you child should be waking at about the same time every morning (ours was at 6:30 am!). When he isn't tired, but it is bed time, then put him to bed anyways. Give him a soft toy, or maybe read him a story or sing, but he should be in bed. It is extremely hard to just sit downstairs and listen to a kid screaming, but he should get the hang of it after a while. Best do it now, before he learns to climb out of the crib. Good luck! -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Dave Lowrey "GORT...Klatu borada niktow" ...!{nsc,sun,hplabs,ihnp4}!amdahl!dwl10 [ The opinions expressed <may> be those of the author and not necessarily those of his most eminent employer. ]
betsy@dartvax.UUCP (Betsy Hanes Perry) (01/18/85)
> > [] > > We have an 8 1/2 month old. Until about two weeks ago we were holding his > > bottle and rocking him to sleep in our arms. We were told that it is a very > > bad habit to get you child into and that he should be going to sleep in his > > crib by himself. We were then given the advise of putting him in his crib > > with the bottle propped to wean him from having to hold him. > > (Disclaimer: I am NOT yet a parent) In a recent mailing from my dentist, he warned against propping babies with bottles in their mouths; it seems that the practice can lead to unnecessary tooth decay. (Something about the baby going to sleep with unswallowed food still available to the decay germs in the mouth.) Incidentally, whose advice was this? Betsy Perry -- Elizabeth Hanes Perry UUCP: {decvax|linus|cornell}!dartvax!betsy CSNET: betsy@dartmouth ARPA: betsy%dartmouth@csnet-relay
tim@ccice5.UUCP (Timothy G. Becker) (01/18/85)
In article <109@spp3.UUCP> robbin@spp3.UUCP writes:
[]
We have an 8 1/2 month old. Until about two weeks ago we were
holding his bottle and rocking him to sleep in our arms. We
were told that it is a very bad habit to get you child into and
that he should be going to sleep in his crib by himself. We
were then given the advise of putting him in his crib with the
bottle propped to wean him from having to hold him.
Propping a bottle is not too great for tooth decay. The milk, juice,
etc lingers in the mouth because the baby is falling asleep and
therefore doesn't swallow.
Tim Becker.
..!{decvax,seismo,allegra}!rochester!ccice5!timijk@hou5e.UUCP (Ihor Kinal) (01/18/85)
One point about kids falling asleep with bottles (presumably of milk). I recently read (in PARENTS, I believe) that this habit could promote drastic tooth decay, and should definitely be avoided!!!! Ihor Kinal hou5e!ijk
hopp@nbs-amrf.UUCP (Ted Hopp) (01/19/85)
We are going through the same experience now with our 11 month old son
Aaron (our first child), and what we are doing seems to be working.
Until he was 8 months old, my wife, Marsha, nursed him to go to sleep.
She moved up the evening nursing to before bedtime and at bedtime we
found we could rock Aaron to sleep without any "props", although it
took him about 2 weeks to get into the habit of going to sleep easily
this way. (He would squirm and want to play, rather than relax and
drift off.) We were careful to use the same routine for his naps and
to keep the same routine every day. The key was to use the routine to
give him a sense of security and confidence in what was happening.
About a month ago, we started putting him into his crib before he was
asleep and staying with him until he went to sleep. Again, there was a
fixed routine, and again, for a couple of weeks he didn't like the
change in routine. The rule we observed was that once in the crib, he
didn't come out.
For the last couple of weeks, we have been leaving him before he goes
to sleep, but after he seems to be settling down. He complains when
we leave the room, and we go back every couple of minutes to reassure
him that he isn't alone. Initially, we had to go back half a dozen
times or so, but he seems to be getting used to this new routine.
Tonight is the first night we haven't had to go back in to calm him
down at all, although he has been going to sleep for his daytime naps
somewhat more easily. (We kept the naptime routine more or less the
same as the nightime routine.)
About a week ago, we noticed that Aaron would go to sleep more easily
for Marsha than for me. (He wouldn't accept my leaving the room
before he was asleep). This wasn't something new, just something we
hadn't noticed before. We think that was because I wasn't around
during the day to put him to bed for his naps, so he wasn't as
confident about being left alone by me. That seems to be changing now
that I am participating in every "to bed" experience that I can.
Most of our ideas came from an excellent book by Penelope Leach, "Your
Baby & Child" (subtitle: From Birth to Age Five). There is a section
on going to sleep for kids between 6 months and 1 year that explains
the reason that a routine (any routine) is so important, what it must
be like for the child to go through these new experiences, and in
general provided us with both good recommendations and a rationale for
the things she recommends. She provides a positive view to this (and
other) potential problems that we found refreshing. I strongly
recommend that you purchase this book. Marsha and I both wish we had
read it before Aaron was born. It would have helped with some of our
earlier frustrations in trying to understand him.
--
Ted Hopp {seismo,umcp-cs}!nbs-amrf!hoppcarlton@masscomp.UUCP (Carlton Hommel) (01/20/85)
In article <109@spp3.UUCP> Robbin Brahms writes: >We have an 8 1/2 month old. Until about two weeks ago we were holding his >bottle and rocking him to sleep in our arms. We were told that it is a very >bad habit to get you child into and that he should be going to sleep in his >crib by himself. Who told you that? A maiden aunt? Someone who hates children? Granted, you're a little to big to get into the crib, but your child will always want to snuggle with you before he goes to bed. As they get older, you will be reading stories, and shooing away the monster under the bed. >We were then given the advise (sic) of putting him in his crib >with the bottle propped to wean him from having to hold him. This must have come from you dentist. No one else would wish this on your child's gums and teeth. You don't wean your child from your arms, you do it from the _bottle_. The bottle should never become an object of affection or security. (That's what teddy bears are for :-) >The problem has been that he seems to cry more and does not go to sleep as >easily as he use to when we held him. Obviously, its not working too well, then. Your child is crying because he needs you. Who else does he have? >Our intention is eventually to get him to go to sleep by himself but it >there any easy transition, or at what age does it seem best to start? Um, well, never. She may start falling asleep by herself (without being held) around 12 months. You should still spend some time reading stories, tucking them in, saying prayers, etc. (This can take from 4 minutes to 40, depending on the child...) Parents and children need to spend time together to further their mutual development, especially when both parents work. Sleepy-bye time is when he gets a quiet, secure feeling from mommie or daddy. Alana Hommel (for) Carl Hommel Wife: We go sleepy-bye now? Husband: In a second; I'm reading a great flame in net.wombat.
larry@cci-bdc.UUCP (Larry DeLuca) (01/21/85)
> (Disclaimer: I am NOT yet a parent) > In a recent mailing from my dentist, he warned against propping babies > with bottles in their mouths; it seems that the practice can lead to unnecessary > tooth decay. (Something about the baby going to sleep with unswallowed > food still available to the decay germs in the mouth.) > > Incidentally, whose advice was this? > Betsy Perry > -- > Elizabeth Hanes Perry > UUCP: {decvax|linus|cornell}!dartvax!betsy > CSNET: betsy@dartmouth > ARPA: betsy%dartmouth@csnet-relay yes, i've seen warnings on television as well. it leads to a condition known as 'nursing-bottle mouth' and is particularly bad with milk, because the milk provides an excellent environment for the growth of the bacteria which cause the decay. you can give a baby water with no ill effects, but i think that's about it (as far as sleeping with it goes)... larry... uucp: ..mit-eddie!cybvax0!cci-bdc!larry arpa: henrik@mit-mc.ARPA -- This mind intentionally left blank.
allenm@ittvax.UUCP (Allen Matsumoto) (01/21/85)
This seems to be another of those topics that people think there are
right and wrong answers to. I think that a lot of those people forget
the main goal is having kids who know they are loved and cared for.
We have three kids, who are 8, 4, and 1. I started out trying to raise
the first in a well-structured way, "by the book", whatever that is.
But my wife convinced me otherwise. The rules in the books (or from
friends) were developed for (unstated) reasons. Often we disagree with
the reasoning, and hence with the rules.
We have an 8 1/2 month old. Until about two weeks ago we were
holding his bottle and rocking him to sleep in our arms. We were
told that it is a very bad habit to get you child into and that he
should be going to sleep in his crib by himself. We were then
given the advise of putting him in his crib with the bottle
propped to wean him from having to hold him.
What's the problem with holding him and rocking him to sleep? The main
one is that it takes your time. Obviously, he will eventually learn to
go to sleep by himself. You can make him learn that sooner, and save
yourself all those minutes holding him, rocking him, singing or talking
to him, getting to watch him. I personally like doing that for our
kids. Maybe the people who gave you that "advice" think it's something
to be avoided.
The problem has been that he seems to cry more and does not go to
sleep as easily as he use to when we held him.
I'm not surprised. Are you? He misses being held. He misses knowing
someone is there when he goes to sleep. Our baby usually goes to sleep
by herself now (she's 16 months old). But when she has a hard time, one
of us will hold her and do something like rocking or walking her around
until she settles down. Sometimes she goes back to bed and falls
asleep, sometimes we have to hold her until she's fast asleep (like last
night, yawn). I would rather have slept, but something was bothering
her and she needed to know we were there for her.
It does get better as they grow. Our older kids get stories for
bedtime. That's usually enough for the 8 year old. The 4 year old
often wants a song (she told me last night that 2 of our songs are just
for babies). The baby gets a lullaby when she doesn't simply fall
asleep when we put her in the crib.
I don't believe that kids fuss and cry attempting to control their
parents. Babies, at least, cry when something is wrong. And I think
it's unhelpful to leave them crying.
If he insists on being around you all the time, that's different. But
just (or mostly) at night, what do you lose by spending 20 or 30 minutes
getting him to sleep?
Robbin Brahms
{ucbvax,decvax}!trwrb!trwspp!spp2!spp1!spp3!robbin
If you like holding him with his bottle, and he obviously does, there's
got to be some really terrific reason not to. I can't think of one.
Let me know if you can, all right?
Allen Matsumoto
ITT Adv. Tech. Center, Stratford, CT 06497
203-385-7218
(decvax!ittvax!allenm)
--
Allen Matsumoto
ITT Adv. Tech. Center, Stratford, CT 06497
203-385-7218
(decvax!ittvax!allenm)
<generic disclaimer>: Any opinions expressed are my opinions.eve@ssc-bee.UUCP (Michael Eve) (01/21/85)
> [] > We have an 8 1/2 month old. Until about two weeks ago we were holding his > bottle and rocking him to sleep in our arms. We were told that it is a very > bad habit to get you child into and that he should be going to sleep in his > crib by himself. We were then given the advise of putting him in his crib > with the bottle propped to wean him from having to hold him. We were told not to give a baby a bottle in the crib for two reasons: 1) The milk may flow down into the eustachian tube and cause ear infections. 2) The milk encourages tooth decay if the baby has teeth. Our young son required being held at bedtime when he was very young (6 months); we switched him over to a system (saw it in a book somewhere?) where we place him in bed when he seems tired and sit beside the crib until he falls asleep. At first, we tried just laying him down and leaving the room. He would cry for 15-20 minutes before falling asleep. He seemed to be crying from both anger and panic at being left alone. With us in the room, he usually lays down and rolls around for 5 minutes then falls asleep without tears. Sometimes he will stand up in which case we give him a hug (without picking him up) until he sits himself down. Sometimes (not often) we make a mistake and put him in bed before he is tired; this is usually evident immediately and we pick him up before he begins crying. We also have a little routine where we walk around the house with him turning off the lights in each room, waving and saying "Goodnight, light " (ala the book Goodnight Moon); this routine seems to be a key part. Many people have told us to just lay him down and leave the room; that crying is a natural way for babies to fall asleep. After visiting some of them when their 18 month olds were put to bed at 8 0'clock on the dot (because that is the OFFICIAL BEDTIME), and listening to them cry for a half hour or more, I prefer to sit quietly with Andrew for a few minutes while he falls asleep . -- Mike Eve Boeing Aerospace, Seattle ...uw-beaver!ssc-vax!ssc-bee!eve
wkp@lanl.ARPA (01/23/85)
Our son Yonatan (Jonathan) who is now 1-1/2 taught us over a year
ago the proper way to put him to sleep. Please share this
information with your kids in case they are unaware of it.
1) Make sure both parents work so they feel guilty they don't spend
enough time with you.
2) Make sure they go on trips, especially to far-away places
like Israel and Hong Kong where their family or friends forgot
to get an extra crib.
3) Get a chest cold now and then so daddy's got to hold you
upright in bed (you know whose bed!) the entire night.
4) Cry like a lost orphan at the very mention of "crib".
This especially works if both parents are tired and need to
get up early the next day.
It is guaranteed that within two weeks your child will be peacefully
sleeping all snuggly-poo in their parents' warm and cozy bed FOREVER.
Anyway, it's sure nice to know that children are smarter than you
thought......
-------------------
bill peter
seismo!cmcl2!lanl!wkp
wkp@lanl.ARPAkenw@lcuxc.UUCP (K Wolman) (01/24/85)
Changes of scenery sometimes help a child go to sleep. I hate to get
pseudo-Freudian and "cutesy" about it, but we found that the temporary
getting to sleep problems we experienced with both our kids got
resolved rather quickly if we let them fall asleep in OUR bed, then
transferred them to their own once they were out cold. Being allowed
to sleep in mommy's (and DADDY'S!) bed seemed to make a major difference.
I wondered if I weren't on the road to some fantastic Oedipal trauma;
but at the time it hurt far more to hear them scream and yell. As it
turned out, this routine lasted about a week or two with both kids at
different times.
Whatever solution you adopt, be comforted in knowing it WILL pass.
Exhaustion generally wins out even over the strongest of wills.
--
Kenneth T. Wolman
Bell Communications Research @ Livingston, NJ
lcuxc!kenw
(201) 740-4565
("My doctorate's in Literature, but that seems like a
pretty good pulse to me. . . .")3215rfs@hogpd.UUCP (R.SOYACK) (01/25/85)
t seems that someone is always ready to give advice about withholding affection and contact from young children. My parents generation were told (I'm 40) that they should not pick babies up when they are crying and very little at other times. This is all so dumb. Human beings need warmth, and love, and human contact (for all of you nit- pickers the repetitive use of "and" is stylistically correct). Young children are human beings. By all means--hug your children, hold your children, and love your children. The world may be cold and cruel, but you don't have to feel compelled to drive that point home. Rich (All nit-pickers may address their comments to /dev/null) .
peg@linus.UUCP (Margaret E. Craft) (02/01/85)
I used the "establish a routine" method desribed in Penelope Leach's book, and summarized by someone to the net. It worked like magic. One additional hint: Part of my 2 year old's routine is to have drink and food within reach. Water in a spout cup and crackers are fine. This is not for the night, but for the next morin morning - buys me a bit of time before she insists on getting out of the crib. I used to put it on her dresser after she was asleep, but she started asking for it at bedtime, so it has become part of the routine. PS - I admit to something that many nursing mothers will only tell their best friends: I nursed Joellen to sleep for over a year. Sure makes the bedtime routine simple!!
plw@drutx.UUCP (KerrPL) (02/02/85)
I have a technique that was used on me as a kid and it still works on my 12 year old daughter. During the nights she is in need of comfort (sick, upset, to tired, or just wanting "back to baby") I am asked to tickle her face. What is done is a light touch around her eyes, nose, and temples. It makes the person's eye muscles relaxed enough that sleep comes. She is asleep in about 10 minute time. As a baby I did hold her while I did this. For those who wish not to hold the baby, stand over the crib. Get ready for a backache in just the 10 minutes that it takes though. Patti Kerr ihnp4!drutx!plw