inc@fluke.UUCP (Gary Benson) (09/05/85)
>> In article <1214@teddy.UUCP> lkk@teddy.UUCP (Larry K. Kolodney) writes: >> Discipline based on fear is worse than no discipline at all. > I must pose to you a situation involving a parent child confrontation. > Parent : Time for bed. > 4yr old: Nope. > > Parent : Please, time for bed now. > 4yr old: Nope. > > Parent : You must go to bed now. > 4yr old: Nope. > > And so on, what would you do? ... You're not allowed to threaten to take his > teddy bear away ... [or] tell him he can't have ice cream if he doesn't > listen. Are not these tactics based on threatening the child with fear, > i.e. no ice cream, take away your buddy the teddy bear. I really want to > know what you would do without some kind of threat. By the way, you are not > allowed to bodily carry him to bed, that would be physically taking matters > in hand and over powering him with your size. Besides, he would just climb > out of bed and come downstairs. What WOULD you do? Try this: Parent: Time for bed, son. 4yr old: Nope. Parent: Are you staying up late tonight? 4yr old: Yup. Parent: OK. Goodnight. See you in the morning. Maybe the kid's gerbil died and he's uspset; perhaps he's angry that the parent broke a promise. Parent-4yr old confrontations don't take place in a vacuum; parents who feel that bedtime is more important than discovering the reason the kid is being obstreperous are just asking for trouble. Here's another possible scenario: Parent: Well, goodnite CindyLou. It's bedtime. 4yr old: I'm not going to bed. Parent: Still upset about the gerbil? 4yr old: Yeah. Parent: Well, let's get some cocoa and talk about it. Some parents would never think of laying a hand on their children, but torture them mentally. The other day at a filling station, a 5-year old had been sent by his dad to hand the attendant the money. The kid stood around looking lost, and about 30 seconds after he arrived, the father came up and said in an angry voice, loud enough for everyone standing around to hear, "What's taking you so long? All you had to do is give the man the money." The child was embarrassed, hurt, and angry, and I don't blame hime. He got back in the car and gave the old man a look that I hope never to see on the face of an offspring of mine. -- Gary Benson * John Fluke Mfg. Co. * PO Box C9090 * Everett WA * 98206 MS/232-E = = {allegra} {uw-beaver} !fluke!inc = = (206)356-5367 _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-ascii is our god and unix is his profit-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
rick@iddic.UUCP (Rick Coates) (09/06/85)
> >> In article <1214@teddy.UUCP> lkk@teddy.UUCP (Larry K. Kolodney) writes: > >> Discipline based on fear is worse than no discipline at all. > > > > [you've all seen this many times about the four-year-old] > > Try this: > > (an alternative that shows some sympathy and attempts to deal with a child > as if (shock!) he/she were a real person.) > > -- > Gary Benson * John Fluke Mfg. Co. * PO Box C9090 * Everett WA * 98206 > MS/232-E = = {allegra} {uw-beaver} !fluke!inc = = (206)356-5367 > _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-ascii is our god and unix is his profit-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ It's good to see that there are some people on the net who can deal with children in the same way that they would deal with other people. (Although I suspect that the 'beat them into submission' group would deal with everyone that way if other people weren't apt to fight back) In all this discussion, I haven't seen A. S. Neill (of Summerhill school fame) mentioned. (This should really add fuel to the flames of the Rambo school of child rearing.) To get things off to a good start, I will re-iterate Neill's distinction between what he called 'freedom' and 'license'. Giving a child a choice between reasonable alternatives is different than allowing a child to do anthing she/he pleases. By the way: I have taught public school in an inner-city school (seventh and eighth grade math - I had over 200 students every day); I have worked with elementary school aged children in a before/after school program (Latchkey); I have taught in Upward Bound (not Outward Bound) in a live-in summer program; I have also taught in suburban junior and senior high schools. I also have a six-month old daughter. Rick Coates ...!tektronix!iddic!rick (I can't say that I really understand the last line of Mr. Benson's signature, but it sounds good (-: [for lefties] )