fcarmody@udenva.UUCP (Prince Caspian) (02/15/86)
From postnews Fri Feb 14 14:49:42 1986
Subject: To spank or not to spank, is it a question?
Newsgroups: net.kids
Distribution: net
Warning: VERY newuser posting.
I apologize to any of you in this group who think I am asking a stupid
question. Even if this has gone around before, I don't think it's likely that
people have heard it stated *quite* this way, so bear with me a sec...
I am not a parent. I am a young adult with an unusual family history. The
only thing I feel justified in saying about that history is that it has left me
quite vulnerable and insecure. The rest is private or semi-private, to protect
myself and others whether innocent or guilty....
One result of my reactions to my past is a deep interest in issues related
to what I can only call "nurturance": family relationships, marriages,
friendships, self-esteem, *and the growth and protection thereof*.
That is the reason I read this group. I want to investigate parenting
and parenting-styles, to apply what I learn wherever I can, personally and
hopefully professionally. End background info. digression.
My question is this. I have been studying the "professional" view of parenting for a number of years now. I have read, or at least perused, every book I
could get my hands on. Some of you may be laughing already as you see what an
obvious mistake that is. :`) In all of this, I have found one very disturbing
commonality. WHY IS SPANKING SO UNIVERSALLY CONDEMNED? No smiley. To me this
is quite serious. Does it make any sense to say that I believe that corporal
punishment *can* have a place in a child's life? Not *for everything*, nor
*for every child*, (as unfortunately the "professionals" would have you think
that *all* spanking parents believe...), simply that it *can* work.
I believe that in some cases, I missed something important when I was not
spanked. I believe that there are some cases where a child's emotional health
is jeopardized by so-called "sensible" discipline of the sort the books espouse,isolation or time-out, lectures, PET, etc. ad nauseum. I believe there are a
lot of myths about what constitutes punishment, what is good discipline, what
is child abuse, and so on. These are quite unhealthy and need debunking, if at
all possible. This is opinion based on experience.
I would like to hear from parents who *do* spank. (Come on, there must be
some of you out there.) What results does it have with your kids?
What do YOU think of yourself and your children when you spank, before,
afterwords? What comes out of it, emotionally, for you and your kids?
If you spank "successfully", what makes the difference?
What kinds of things do you spank for, and avoid spanking for?
What is the differance between the way you handle spankings in your family,
and "child abuse"? Do you cross the line sometimes? How and why, and how do youavoid it?
If you don't believe that spanking has any value, you need not respond,
as I have been thoroughly acquainted with every sort of argument against it.
IF YOU USE IT, PLEASE DO NOT USE SCRIPTURAL SUPPORT OF ANY KIND TO
PRESENT YOUR REASONS. I am a Christian, and believe in "the rod" on scriptural
grounds, BUT NOT FOR THAT REASON ALONE. I am specifically trying to challenge
the assumption that ALL SPANKING IS ABUSE. This requires evidence having nothing to do with one's religious convictions. Feel free to tell me anything else
about how, why and when you spank, but don't tell me it's because God, your
parents, or anybody else either told you, or paddled you, or whatever....
*Think about it*.
Sorry if I ramble on. Please mail, and I will post summary to the net,
or get someone who will post the summmary for me if necessary....
In all Dilligence and Goodwill, Caspian.
From postnews Fri Feb 14 17:21:03 1986
Subject: PATH TO CHALI AND DAVE, URGENT.....
Newsgroups: net.religion.christian,net.religion
Distribution: usa
To Charli phillips and Dave Whoever (fluke!ptl)
I think I need that site-map you offered. Sorry Dave, for not remembering your
last name at the moment. I can't seem to get to anybody off-site by email....
But then, I've only tried once so far. I'm a *very* newuser, so it might take
me awhile to set things up...
Charli, thanks for caring so much. I need to get back to you on a few things...Sorry to post to the net, folks.
In His Peace
Caspian
--
- Prince Caspian of Narnia, AKA Francis X. Carmody
Electronic Adress (UUcp only:{hplabs,seismo}!hao!udenva!fcarmody}
OR: {boulder,cires,denelcor,cisden}!udenva!fcarmody
The above opinions are my own, noone else in the known galaxy should be held responsable, except in the rare cases where they coincide with the opinions of Almighty God... In the above case, any disagreement with said opinions should be refferred directly to Him....
:wsnell@utzoo.UUCP (Richard Snell) (02/17/86)
It is my view (having never been spanked, and having grown into a fairly
reasonable person who would NEVER spank my own child), that
1. spanking = child abuse. Period.
2. it may produce immediate "results" but the long-term costs out-weigh
any short term benifiefits.
3. I hope "spankers" send their "justifications" to the author of the
original article via email--though it might provide interesting reading
(depressing too) to see why intelligent adults think they should smack
their kids around (or their spouse around... ). No smiley here.
Richard Snell, UofToronto Zoology
--
Name: Richard Snell
Mail: Dept. Zoology, Univ. Toronto
Toronto, Ontario, Canada M5S 1A1
UUCP: {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!snellrggoebel@watdragon.UUCP (Randy Goebel LPAIG) (02/18/86)
> It is my view (having never been spanked, and having grown into a fairly > reasonable person who would NEVER spank my own child), that > 1. spanking = child abuse. Period. > 2. it may produce immediate "results" but the long-term costs out-weigh > any short term benifiefits. > 3. I hope "spankers" send their "justifications" to the author of the > original article via email--though it might provide interesting reading > (depressing too) to see why intelligent adults think they should smack > their kids around (or their spouse around... ). No smiley here. > Richard Snell, UofToronto Zoology --------------------------- Such a strong statement; seems pretty zero/one. I, on the other hand, am convinced that the concept of spanking is useful. There are many forms of abuse; perhaps those who so strongly criticise physical spanking perpetrate mental child abuse instead?
tw8023@pyuxii.UUCP (T Wheeler) (02/19/86)
Richard Snell may be interested in reading the most current edition of Dr Spock's baby book concerning spanking. The drift from never spank to an occasional, if really needed, whack on the rear is interesting if you have read his earlier editions. Just remember, discipline is NOT a dirty word. T. C. Wheeler