rlr@pyuxn.UUCP (Rich Rosen) (06/29/84)
> MY understanding of the lesbian community is that there is a subgroup of > lesbians who choose to be lesbians for "political" reasons. These are > usually women like Ellen who consciously choose to be lesbians because they > think that men are creeps (to put it lightly). From the litterature I've > read by some of these women, the point (or reason or whatever) of this > switch is to rediscover female sexuality which has been buried under male > propaganda of what sex should be like: foreplay + intercourse (+ washing > oneself (-:). > This view of sexuality is usually accompanied by a different philosophy of > how the world should be, a place where caring and emotions are important, > etc..... > It also seems (and here I am not as aware of the actual reality as I am > in the case of lesbians, so correct me if I am wrong) that there is a > subculture in the gay culture which is the complete antithesis of this > lesbian ideal: power is the basis of sex and a great emphasis is put on > anonymousness, sex for sex' sake with no place for feelings, promiscuity > etc (i.e the image that most "straights" have of gays), in other words > everything that political lesbians loathe in "straight" men pushed to its > extreme. It would seem that there are similar "subgroups" of both types amongst both lesbians and gays, although the notion of one's sexuality being construed as a sociopolitical statement seems limited to some radical feminist lesbians. (Though I've met gay men who have made their decision based on similar ideals: being gay because one feels little in common with the straight male community and more in common with the gay community, as opposed to being gay because one is simply and directly *attracted* to members of the same sex). Months ago there was some sort of (very limited, apparently) discussion on those who believed that lesbian S&M was "politically incorrect" (as if that should have a bearing on how people choose to live their lives!!!), because it DID perpetuate the male/female power relationship that women "should" (according to the proponents) be avoiding as lesbians. I would think that there are gays and lesbians both who seek in their relationships an avoidance of standard social sex roles, and also that there are those who go to the opposite extreme to emulate (almost in parody form) what they see in male/female relationships. (S&M, both heterosexual and homosexual, seems to be such an example carried to a very extreme extreme. "The Story of O" always seemed to me like a parable for this concept: sexual relationships as possession.) I should point out that there exists the same dichotomy amongst straight people, where some live out the "expected" roles (some push them to the point of self-parody), and others reject them and seek very different sex roles from the so-called norm. > Obviously lesbians and gay men do have common interests since they are > both discriminated against by society at large, so as there is power > in numbers it is in their interest to join forces to try to achieve > better rights in society. However the philosophies of these two > subgroups seem to be so irreconciliable (that of the political lesbians > and of the "promiscuous" (let's say) gay men, not of lesbians and > gay men in general) that I wonder how they manage to work together when > their ideals are so different. I was just curious as to whether this produces > a rift into the gay culture, whether these two subcultures just ignore > themselves except to join forces to get things accomplished, or whether > there is hatred or debating going on about ideals etc.... I'd read that surveys showed that, generally, male homosexual relationships *were* of the "fleeting", promiscuous variety, while lesbian relationships tended to be more long-lived. But, again, these are just generalizations. Since Sophie had originally directed her questions at Steve and other gays/lesbians who might be in an "answering-questions-from-straights" mood, I'll shut up now and hopefully let that answering begin. -- If it doesn't change your life, it's not worth doing. Rich Rosen pyuxn!rlr