schoet@ucbvax.ARPA (Steve Schoettler) (02/03/85)
25 questions to ask your heterosexual friends, from Martin Rochin, Ph.D. 1. What do you think caused your heterosexuality? 2. When and how did you first decide you were a heterosexual? 3. Is it possible that your heterosexuality is just a phase you may grow out of? 4. Is it possible your heterosexuality stems from a neurotic fear of others of the same sex? 5. Isn't it possible that all you need is a good gay lover? 6. Heterosexuals have histories of failures in gay relationships. Do you think you may have turned to heterosexuality in fear of rejection? 7. If you've never slept with a person of the same sex, how do you know you wouldn't prefer that? 8. If your heterosexuality is normal, why are a disproportionate number of mental patients heterosexual? 9. With whom have you discussed your heterosexual tendencies? How did they react? 10. Your heterosexuality doesn't offend me as long as you don't try to force it on me. Why do you people feel compelled to seduce others into your sexual orientation? 11. If you choose to nurture children, would you want them to be heterosexual, knowing the problems they would face? 12. The great majority of child molesters are heterosexuals. Do you really consider it safe to expose your children to heterosexual teachers? 13. Why do you insist on being so obvious, and making a public spectacle of your heterosexuality? Can't you just be what you are and keep it quiet? 14. How can you ever hope to become a whole person if you limit yourself to a compulsive, exclusive heterosexual object choice, and remain unwilling to explore and develop your normal, natural, healthy, God-given homosexual potential? 15. Heterosexuals are noted for assigning themselves and each other to narrowly restricted stereotyped sex roles. Why do you cling to such unhealthy role-playing? 16. How can you enjoy a fully satisfying sexual experience or deep emotional rapport with a person of the opposite sex, when the obvious physical, biological, and temperamental defferences between you are so vast? How can a man understand what pleases a woman sexually, or vise-versa? 17. Why do heterosexuals place so much emphasis on sex? 18. With all the societal support marriage receives, the divorce rate is spiralling. Why are there so few stable relationships among heterosexuals? 19. How could the human race survive if everyone were a heterosexual like you, considering the menace of overpopulation? 20. There seem to be very few happy heterosexuals. Techniques have been developed with which you might be able to change if you really want to. Have you ever tried aversion therapy? 21. A disproportionate number of criminals, welfare reccipients, and other irresponsible or anti-social types are heterosexual. Why would anyone want to hire a heterosexual for a responsible position? 22. Do heterosexuals hate and/or distrust others of their own sex? Is that what makes them heterosexual? 23. Why are heterosexuals so promiscuous? 24. Why do you make a point of attributing heterosexuality to famous people? Is it to justify your own heterosexuality? 25. Could you really trust a heterosexual therapist/counselor to be objective and unbiased? Don't you fear that he/she might be inclined to influence you in the direction of his/her own leanings? Steve Schoettler schoet@ucbvax
guest@hplabs.UUCP (HP Labs Guest/guest) (02/13/85)
> 25 questions to ask your heterosexual friends, from Martin Rochin, Ph.D. Let's see if this goes well; if not then no posting. 1) I am hetrosexual. 2) I am not anti-homosexual. 3) Some of my best ... (naw, I couldn't say it. It's too trite.) 4) I just thought (wrongly) that you'ld want some answers. > 1. What do you think caused your heterosexuality? Wow, it starts off tough (no :-) intended). It wasn't peer pressure, it might have been upbringing, it just felt right for me. > 2. When and how did you first decide you were a heterosexual? At age 12 when I fell madly in love(infatuation), an made SUCH a fool of myself. > 3. Is it possible that your heterosexuality is just a phase > you may grow out of? Yes. > 4. Is it possible your heterosexuality stems from a neurotic > fear of others of the same sex? No. Not fear. Since I answered #3 as I did, I think I'm safe here. I simply relate to women greatly differently than to men. (Much to my pain.) > 5. Isn't it possible that all you need is a good gay lover? Since I haven't any lover, I can only guess that this isn't the problem. > 6. Heterosexuals have histories of failures in gay relationships. Do > you think you may have turned to heterosexuality in fear of rejection? No, were rejection my only problem, I might be gay. > 7. If you've never slept with a person of the same sex, how > do you know you wouldn't prefer that? What if both sides of the question were unexplored? (The previous is neither an admission nor a denial of any state. Only an emotional adolesent would be so hung up as to get this far and try to skirt this question. I guess I am such.) > 8. If your heterosexuality is normal, why are a disproportionate > number of mental patients heterosexual? Really? I had no such knowledge. Where can I check that? > 9. With whom have you discussed your heterosexual tendencies? > How did they react? Many people, prospects for girlfriend status, friends, parents, a gay friend who had hoped to find a MOTSS, ... . They (uniformly) seemed to be understanding, and willing to let me follow the path that I had chosen. I hope you all see equal understanding. > 10. Your heterosexuality doesn't offend me as long as you don't try > to force it on me. Why do you people feel compelled to seduce > others into your sexual orientation? Whoh, I think you've got me confused with someone else! > 11. If you choose to nurture children, would you want them to be > heterosexual, knowing the problems they would face? Yes. > 12. The great majority of child molesters are heterosexuals. Do you really > consider it safe to expose your children to heterosexual teachers? Why didn't you say "disproportionate" here? > 13. Why do you insist on being so obvious, and making a public spectacle > of your heterosexuality? Can't you just be what you are and keep it quiet? No, I don't ask it of you; don't ask it of me. > 14. How can you ever hope to become a whole person if you limit > yourself to a compulsive, exclusive heterosexual object choice, and > remain unwilling to explore and develop your normal, natural, > healthy, God-given homosexual potential? First I need to explore the world I prefer. Until then I see no reason to try less prefered avenues. > 15. Heterosexuals are noted for assigning themselves and each other to > narrowly restricted stereotyped sex roles. > Why do you cling to such unhealthy role-playing? I don't know. It is really upsetting too. I didn't get a good role. > 16. How can you enjoy a fully satisfying sexual experience or deep > emotional rapport with a person of the opposite sex, when the > obvious physical, biological, and temperamental differences > between you are so vast? How can a man understand what pleases > a woman sexually, or vise-versa? Ask them. Try to communicate. How will we be fit to relate to the other intelligences around if we cannot relate to the other half of our species. > 17. Why do heterosexuals place so much emphasis on sex? It's in my genes (not jeans :-) ). > 18. With all the societal support marriage receives, the divorce rate > is spiralling. Why are there so few stable relationships > among heterosexuals? You've got me here. > 19. How could the human race survive if everyone were a heterosexual like > you, considering the menace of overpopulation? I'm not one of the overpopulators. My scrawny genes may not make it past this generation. Does that make me less of a person? (This may actually be an improvement of the race.) > 20. There seem to be very few happy heterosexuals. Techniques have been > developed with which you might be able to change if you > really want to. Have you ever tried aversion therapy? Yes, I did. It certainly didn't make me happy. There are so few happy PEOPLE, must we fight about everything? > 21. A disproportionate number of criminals, welfare reccipients, > and other irresponsible or anti-social types are heterosexual. > Why would anyone want to hire a heterosexual for a responsible position? This question really makes me discard question #12. Unfortunately, I still would have to see the sources of your data. As a note on statistics I do point out that the majority of all people are not above average. > 22. Do heterosexuals hate and/or distrust others of their own sex? > Is that what makes them heterosexual? That may be a factor, but I suspect it is simply an attraction from the opposite sex and not a repulsion from the same sex. To be attracted to an alternative, not because it is pleasant, only because it is "the lesser of two evils" seems terrible to me. > 23. Why are heterosexuals so promiscuous? (If only :-) ) I decline comment. > 24. Why do you make a point of attributing heterosexuality to > famous people? Is it to justify your own heterosexuality? You're not talking to me here. > 25. Could you really trust a heterosexual therapist/counselor to be > objective and unbiased? Don't you fear that he/she might be > inclined to influence you in the direction of his/her own leanings? No one is "objective and unbiased". You simply have to take peoples biases into account (of course, they take that into account, you take their taking that into account into account, ...) > Steve Schoettler schoet@ucbvax Thanks Steve, for the enlightning questionaire. It did point out several things to me. Among the ones not touched upon above. 1) Have I examined the evidence used in making assertions about homosexuality/hetrosexuality? 2) It did effectively turn around a few stereotypes. 3) It did make personally directed questions that might better have been qualified or moved to a different section of its survey. (e.g. Q24, Q15, Q13, Q10) [ I decided to see if I could do this anonymously, since I am not a crusader. I hope it worked. ]
daemon@decwrl.UUCP (The devil himself) (02/19/85)
Re: Heterosexual Questionnaire_________________________________________________
I think our anonymous ...hplabs!guest has missed the main point of the
questionnaire, which was to show that many of the questions asked of homosexu-
als come off. This is done by putting the shoe on the proverbial other foot.
I find it very amusing that ...hplabs!guest was quibbling about the
three "statistical questions" (disproportionately more heterosexuals in mental
homes, more heterosexual child abusers ("why", he asked, "didn't you say *dis-
proportionately more?"), and disproportionately more heterosexual criminals
and welfare recipients). For one thing, I'd guess that the main point is
that meaningless statistics are often used like this *against* homosexuals.
Another thing is that these statistics are *very* likely, considering just
the demographics - where most homosexuals are and where most mental patients,
criminals, and welfare recipients are. (Of course, I wouldn't go on this
alone, but I'd be less likely to get all critical with a questionnaire that
is supposed to be, after all, facetious.)
<_Jym_>
:::::::::::::::: Jym Dyer
::::' :: `:::: Dracut, Massachusetts
::' :: `::
:: :: :: DYER%VAXUUM.DEC@DECWRL.ARPA
:: .::::. :: {allegra|decvax|ihnp4|ucbvax}!decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-vaxuum!dyer
::..:' :: `:..::
::::. :: .:::: Statements made in this article are my own; they might not
:::::::::::::::: reflect the views of |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| Equipment Corporation.guest@hplabs.UUCP (HP Labs Guest/guest) (02/20/85)
> Re: Heterosexual Questionnaire____________________________________________ > > I think our anonymous ...hplabs!guest has missed the main point of the > questionnaire, which was to show that many of the questions asked of homosexu- > als come off. This is done by putting the shoe on the proverbial other foot. Yes, that was quite clear. I thought that I remarked about that at the end of my little diatribe. Did you miss the ending remarks. (There is no way to clearly express any thought other than a program over the net. One simply cannot communicate with English.) I think that I have not missed the point. I agree with the point that many such questions are: 1) inappropriate, 2) insensitive, 3) meaningless, or 4) based on inappropriate or false data. BTW: What did you mean by " . . . , which was to show that many of the questions asked of homosexuals come off."? I am not making a grammar flame; I don't know what you meant. > I find it very amusing that ...hplabs!guest was quibbling about the > three "statistical questions" (disproportionately more heterosexuals in mental > homes, more heterosexual child abusers ("why", he asked, "didn't you say *dis- > proportionately more?"), and disproportionately more heterosexual criminals > and welfare recipients). For one thing, I'd guess that the main point is > that meaningless statistics are often used like this *against* homosexuals. > Another thing is that these statistics are *very* likely, considering just > the demographics - where most homosexuals are and where most mental patients, > criminals, and welfare recipients are. (Of course, I wouldn't go on this > alone, but I'd be less likely to get all critical with a questionnaire that > is supposed to be, after all, facetious.) > :::::::::::::::: Jym Dyer But the statistics aren't meaningless if they're stated as in those the two questions that said "disproportionate". Are those data true, or simply reversals of common anti-gay prejudices? It wasn't clear that the questionaire was facetious. (This reinforces my contention that there is no way to clearly express any thought other than a program over the net. Was the questionaire merely facetious?) I thought that it had questions that it was good for me to consider. After all, why shouldn't I turn around the prejudices and see where I stand. I made my stand on meaningless statistics quite clear (to me) in my posting. Why to you so vehemently agree with me? Was it not clear that I saw that they might be meaningless? The correct response when someone hits you with a statistic is not to say "That's meaningless!" You should determine what the caveats, withheld information, limitations, and inapplicabilities of the data are; then you can zing them with the stats. In summation: I agree with you in general, but I claim that you agreed with me. I missed where we differ; except that I actually chose to attempt the "rigged" quiz, whereas it seems you would have had me claim "it's rigged!" and stalk off claiming that I'm being attacked.