levasseur@morgan.DEC (Ray EMD & S Admin 223-5027) (08/01/85)
Ahem! > What followed in the above article were descriptions of several stereotyped > behaviors the author found in gay bars. > > The article distressed me. If it was intended to be humorous, it missed > the mark with me. I found it merely to be nasty criticism of the behavior of > people only seen at a distance. The criticism seems to me to be pointless - it > does not shed any light on the behaviors described - it merely criticizes > without any attempt at understanding. I realized some may view my reaction as > humorless, but it really hurts me when I see a gay man putting down others > in this fashion. > > LABEL JARS, NOT PEOPLE. > > I don't know, maybe I'm just in a humorless mood today. > -- > > > +--------------+-------------------------------+ > | Rob Bernardo | Pacific Bell | ________ |------| / \ | ______ | Is this a new brand of poppers?> | | gay| | :-) | ------ | |________| True! it doesn't shed any light on the behavior. No! it wasn't just a bitchy article to poke fun at gays. This is one aspect of gay life "bars" which exhibits the most lunacy. Shed light, hmmm! I ran into one of the bartenders from A boston bar who's been in the business for 20 years; San Francisco, New York, now here. His explanation for all of the crazy behavior was insecurity and repressed anger. As far as he was concerned these kids were still fighting leftover battles with mommy, daddy and the kids in school. Gay people put up with a lot more than their peers while growing up. Sad thing is that all too many of them carry 10 times their weight in excess emotional baggage from childhood. When they grow up there's no one else to dump it on so the nearest guy in th bar is a good candidate; attitude, cattiness, etc is no more than the product of an emotional slush fund. Another contributing factor I didn't mention is alcohol. It's pretty common knowledge that alcoholism is a severe problem in our community; much more so than the population at large. It's also a coping mechanism some guys use to cope with their emotional slush funds. Serious alcoholics also have a tendency to be dishonest; with themselves and others. A lot of pathological liars and game players have serious problems with alcohol. Add to this the guys who must do their drugs before going out and you're dealing with an unreal world. Go to a bar some night and don't have anything to drink. Wait until about midnight; the show is pretty, so funny it's sad. Have you ever been involved with "The Advocate Experience"? I was and it taught me a lot about this kinda thing. I feel bad for and get impat- ient with the poor souls who must be at the bar 7 nights a week. The envir- onent in bars offers anonymity so people can be at their worst and get away with it. I'll be posting an article regarding "coming out as a lifelong process" There isn't any finger pointing or stereotyping in it but I do mention grow- ing from self defeating modes of behavior. Sorry Bob, if I ruffled you. Hope I didn't illuminate something you didn't want to see; I have a way of doing that. Ray
rob@ptsfa.UUCP (Rob Bernardo) (08/03/85)
With regards to Ray's article I wrote in part: > What followed in the above article were descriptions of several stereotyped > behaviors the author found in gay bars. > > The article distressed me. If it was intended to be humorous, it missed > the mark with me. I found it merely to be nasty criticism of the behavior of > people only seen at a distance. The criticism seems to me to be pointless - it > does not shed any light on the behaviors described - it merely criticizes > without any attempt at understanding. I realized some may view my reaction as > humorless, but it really hurts me when I see a gay man putting down others > in this fashion. Ray, in part, replied: > True! it doesn't shed any light on the behavior. No! it wasn't just a >bitchy article to poke fun at gays. This is one aspect of gay life "bars" >which exhibits the most lunacy. I think Ray missed my point. What I tried to say with some amount of diplomancy was that at least to me it DID come across as a bitchy article poking fun at gays. That Ray is gay has no bearing on whether or not it poked fun at gays. Generally, I get brushed the wrong way by this sort of "joking". When done between people you know, well, it least you KNOW personally whether their REAL feelings towards gays as a group are homophobic or not. But when a stranger, even if gay, "jokes" around about gays, I wonder if he deep down inside thinks lowly of me, too, since I am gay. -- +--------------+-------------------------------+ | Rob Bernardo | Pacific Bell | +--------------+ 2600 Camino Ramon, Room 4E700 | | 415-823-2417 | San Ramon, California 94583 | +--------------+-------------------------------+---------+ | ihnp4!ptsfa!rob | | {nsc,ucbvax,decwrl,amd,fortune,zehntel}!dual!ptsfa!rob | +--------------------------------------------------------+