fisher@smiley.DEC (Gerry --- Terminally Inane) (08/04/85)
Re. Ken Arndt: Delta agent and Hep B > I'd like to hear a homosexual on the net discuss the pros and cons of what > I've said about homosexual sexual practices in light of recent (and future) > events. You want me Ken, you got me! By the way, don't call me "homosexual." I'm Gay. It's impolite to call a Black person a "Negro," it's just as impolite to call us "homosexual." Last week, somebody posted an article that said that Ken's articles are destructive and may cause someone to do damage to him/her self. At the time, I thought that person was being melodramatic and was giving Ken more power than he deserves. After the last posting, I am in agreement that there is underlying hatred and prejudice in Ken's postings; I can't see anything in them except ill will. However, I don't think we should tell him to stop posting. We need to address people like Ken everyday, and I think that it would be good practice to listen to Ken and to refute all that is incorrect, to affirm all that is true. > ... With all the talk about the AIDS virus moving to the hets it's still very > largely a homosexually vectored disease! This is the central point of all Ken's arguments. The point seems to be (I'm zeroing in on the word, vector) that the disease "started" with the gays and that we are spreading it to straights. Even if Ken doesn't believe that AIDS was created by Gays, he seems unconcerned how the disease was introduced into the Gay community. Diseases move from one group to another. Are you going to blame hemopheliacs with AIDS for unknowingly infecting their wives and/or children? I think not. > ... It's a > whole raft of diseases that come in the door (dare I say the back door) > from homosexual sexual practices. First of all, doctors have confirmed that *if both men have been checked by a physician*, most gay sexual practices are not harmful to ones health. This includes anal intercourse without condoms, oral to genital sex, and oral to anal sex (rimming). It is only when diseases are introduced into the community that they are spread by gay sexual practice. By the way, all sexual activities that Gay people practice, are practiced by straight people; check your sex manuals. GAY SEX DOES NOT CREATE DISEASE. GAY SEX DOES NOT SPREAD DISEASES ANY MORE THAN STRAIGHT SEX DOES. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A "GAY DISEASE." IN OTHER CONTINENTS, STRAIGHT SEX IS THE "VECTOR" OF AIDS. Ken, if you want to continue to promote your "Gay vector" argument, please cite sources. See any literature on safe sex and AIDS. I'll cite specific sources if you want me to. Ken is correct when he implies that irresponsible sexual behavior can spread AIDS. The only problem is, what is responsible and what is irresponsible? I don't think I've had a sexual encounter in the past two years that didn't include a discussion on limits an safe sex. It is unreasonable for people to stop having sex; we need the intimacy. However, it is each Gay man's responsibility to avoid unsafe practices in the face of this epidemic. We have to keep striving to find out for sure what is safe and what is not. That is why education must go hand in hand with research. One note on "promiscuity": Gay men are getting a bum rap. We have been told that we are diseased, that we are unnatural, that we are child molesters, that we are emotionally disturbed, that we are unfit to be parents, that we do not deserve to have equal civil rights in housing, credit, and employment, and that it is okay if we are beaten and killed because we are a threat to "normal" society. These ludicrous ideas are reinforced day in and day out in the media, at work, in school, and in church. When Gay people succumb to this bigotry and hatred, when they behave as our oppressors tell us we behave, those very same oppressors point their fingers at us and say, "See! We told you that you were sick." Ken, give us equal rights in housing, employment, and credit, acknowledge our relationships as valid, acknowledge our community and its works, support us as the valuable citizens that we are, let us have community centers where we can meet in an alcohol free environment, let us "come out" and be honest with ourselves and others, and I would bet my life that "promiscuity" would be curbed, the public rest rooms would not be so crowded, and the bushes in the Rest Areas would clear out. > ... doctor on the same program with Dr. Tim stated that a > person should stay away from sperm ... Please give us the whole quote. He said that sperm injected into the body (specifically, any activity where blood and sperm can come in contact) is the danger. Mutual masturbation is safe. It is still debatable as to whether or not oral to genital sex is safe, and whether or not condoms block the AIDS virus during anal intercourse. > But if the disease is 'epidemic' because > of homosexual sexual practices doesn't that make YOU responsible for > the suffering and deaths within and without the homosexual community?? This is an unbelievably *hateful* thing to say in the face of such overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Please read the following: 1) Most Gay people have radically altered their sexual behavior. If you don't think this is a tough feat, I'd like to see *you* stop having intercourse without a rubber or stop having oral sex just before climax. :-) 2) In the years before AIDS became a hot issue for straights, the Gay community was the only "vector" for information on the disease. We were the only group (and still one of the few groups) who are spending any money at all on education; this includes the education of other "high risk" groups such as Haitians and I/V drug users. 3) Years ago, Virginia Apuzzo (then director of the National Gay Task Force) and Ted Weiss (congressperson from New York) fought the US government, charging that they were letting an epidemic get out of hand. It was only when Time and Newsweek and Mr. Rivera of 20/20 got straight people upset about transfusions that the government spent one dime on AIDS. 4) The Gay community has spent an amazing amount of time, money, and energy fighting AIDS. We were fighting this disease before the US government spent *one dime* on funding. In Boston, the AIDS Action Committee estimated that volunteers donated $300,000 worth of time in 1984. JUST TIME! That does not include financial backing. The entire budget will soon approach one million dollars. Until 1985, the AAC did not receive one cent of funding from the government; Gay people, in large, payed the bills. Ken! Gay people who practice safe sex should have a clear conscience. The government, on the other hand, should be held accountable for the proliferation of this epidemic. Homophobic straight people who ignored AIDS as long as it was "only killing faggots" should be held responsible. Did you think we could educate, modify our behavior, and find a cure by ourselves? Question: would you blame Blacks for sickle cell anemia? Would you blame other groups for the diseases that seem relegated to their communities? True: those other diseases aren't spread through sexual contact, but what makes sexually transmitted diseases so different? People are sexual, they cannot avoid that. Could it be our fear of sex? Maybe our fear of pleasure! > ...more people pull back from risk of exposure or what THEY perceive as risk > of exposure. Their perceptions are blinded by hatred and prejudice. They are more to blame for the AIDS epidemic than Gay people. More money for education! You can find a cure for the disease, but we must educate to stop the spread! ************************************************************************ A request: Ken, please stop making off-the-cuff, subtly homophobic remarks unless you verify your stance. As follows: > ... "high risk group" so coyly mentioned in the public health notices ... Why "coyly?" The groups have been clearly defined in all literature I've seen. > ... thinks twice about playing the whore ... I hope that this was a quote from the original article! Are you saying that it is "natural" for Gay men to play the "whore?" > ... although lately it seems he attributes it to a sense > ... of maturity about his relationships. "It seems!" Are you saying that it is doubtful that he is telling the truth? Are you saying that Gay people aren't able to have maturity about relationships? > ... Soon it will be a crime to stay in the stall of a public > washroom for more than three minutes. Are you saying that all Gays frequent public washrooms? Even if some do, what did this have to do with your argument? > ... it becomes clear that 'nature' doesn't allow that the rectum is a sexual > organ? I then ask what are you left with? The bend of elbows or knees?? > And of course the other, ha ha. ha ha. 1) If it happens naturally, and with me and my boyfriend it certainly does, isn't it natural? 2) Why did "god" put the prostate gland in the rectum? So that we can get happy when we defecate? Why is anal sex pleasurable? Desirable (to some)? 3) I don't think you are qualified to judge "natural." The Hite report and Master's and Johnson say that the gay sexual response is a "natural human sexual response;" certain religions say it it "unnatural." Please cite your sources on this opinion, or are you referring to it being unnatural to you and your sexual orientation? > Hope they soon come up with a cure, I felt really bad about Rock Hudson. > What a waste of a human being. Why, because he is dying or because he is (possibly) Gay? Why weren't you so moved when 6,000 Gay men died of the disease during the past five years? Why? Why? Why? *************************************************************************** > Remember, I still lov ya even if I think you're wrong. When are we (in the > Boston area) gettin' together?? I apologize, but from the homophobic tone of the entire posting, I sincerly doubt it. As for Ken's get together, you can count me out. *************************************************************************** Sorry for the length, but his issues needed to be addressed. I feel purged. I need to do some work now. Gay people, be strong. As long as there are human beings, there will be Gay people. We are a strong and gentle people, fighting for our lives, and the lives and freedoms of all others. Gerry Fisher ...decvax!decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-smiley!fisher *************************************************************************** Nashua, NH: Where the men are men, and the sheep are nervous.