pete@kvvax4.UUCP (01/05/70)
You are being overly concerned. What have you done that makes you
afraid to give people your name and address? Personally, I don't
particularly mind if I'm headhunted anyway - it is possible to say no,
you know, just the same as you can turn off the television. If you
really wanted to remain anonymous, you should certainly not join public
nets like USENET/EUNET and even if you do it seems a little unwise to
send news with your net address all over it.
One other comment. We also do not permit sites to ring in to us. This
is because we are a commercial organisation with a significant local
area net, and at least some concern for security. We were lucky enough
to persuade our management to allow us the connection at all, but random
machines ringing in was more than they would tolerate. So we autodial
daily to an EUNET backbone site in Netherland to pick up news and mail,
and if we can get support for the idea we hope to function as a backbone
in Norway, again by ringing out to leaf sites on a regular basis.
Pete Story {decvax,philabs}!mcvax!kvport!kvvax4!pete
A/S Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk, PO Box 25, N3601 Kongsberg, Norway
--
Pete Story {decvax,philabs}!mcvax!kvport!kvvax4
A/S Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk, PO Box 25, N3601 Kongsberg, Norwayglc@akgua.UUCP (G.L. Cleveland [Lindsay]) (01/02/84)
<<>> For those who did not see it, the following was posted to both net.news.adm and net.general. My comments and concerns follow. >>Path: akgua!clyde!floyd!cmcl2!philabs!seismo!hao!kpno!amd70!decwrl!sun!qubix!idi!kiessig >>From: kiessig@idi.UUCP >>Newsgroups: net.general,net.news.adm >>Subject: UUCP Network Directory >>Message-ID: <127@idi.UUCP> >>Organization: Intelligent Decisions, Saratoga, CA >> >> >> The UUCP Network Directory will include information on >>all known sites and all known people at those sites. The information >>will be garnered from many sources, and help confirming the >>accuracy is very important. Many of you will soon be receiving >>messages asking for information about yourselves and your site. >>I would appreciate it if you could answer as many questions as >>possible. Many people who respond will be included in the first >>"trial version", to be published in time for Uniforum in January. >>I will want to get in touch with site administrators directly. >> >> The amount of information involved here is very large. >>The directory as first published will likely not contain but a >>fraction of people and sites actually running UUCP. However, >>it is expected to grow quickly, and accurately. In pursuing >>accuracy, only people and sites returning complete information >>to me will be included. To save me the trouble of mailing you >>an individual form, you can complete the one below and mail it >>back to me. Remember, I am only interested in people who >>actively read their mail. >> >> Your name as you wish it to appear in print >> Your current work address and phone number >> Your preferred uucp address >> Path to/from a major node(s) >> Home address (optional) >> Home phone (optional) >> Something about yourself (optional) >> The uucp address of your site administrator (if known) >> >> I would also apreciate a list of as many names as you >>can of other people on your machine, and their uucp addresses. >>If you can provide any of the above information for them as >>well as for yourself, that would be great. >> >> Thank You, >>-- >>Rick Kiessig >>decvax!sun!idi!kiessig or ucbvax!sun!idi!kiessig What gives? Is this a new technique for getting the corporate telephone book? (Provide information about everyone else in your company!!) After this list is provided do we now get flooded with telephone calls not only to our business telephone but also to our homes as well? Wouldn't some sales department really *love* to know the names, telephone numbers, and background (including current project) of the folks in Bell Labs. Talk about targeting your sales pitch to the right person! Another great use for this would be to a "headhunter" company. Whenever they have an "order" for someone with a particular background and skill, they just look thru this handy list and try to "raid" folks from any company that was gullible enough to provide this information. I just hope that my "friends" don't put my name and information in without my permission. Talk about 1984 and Big Brother with his dossiers! Another thing: I don't find anything about site "idi" in either net.news.map or net.newsite. This Kiessig fellow has just popped up out of "nowhere" and wants everyone to start sending him lists of personnel. He has already contacted this site (akgua) asking about all the sites to which we have uucp/mail connections. That in itself I find quite all right since that relates to the net. Secondly he wanted to set up a direct uucp link between us, which I always encourage anyway. But then comes the interesting wrinkle...his site cannot be called! He says they have no dial-in, yet he feels to free to call other sites! ("Don't call us; we'll call you!") Maybe I am jumping at ghosts and there is nothing untoward behind all this, after all, the name of the company is "Intelligent Decisions", and being in California it *has* to be worthwhile. As an appropriate courtesy, I shall of course mail a copy of this item directly to Kiessig (provided his machine sees fit to call mine). Could I please get some feedback from the rest of the net. I'd like to know if I am being overly concerned or is this now the "Wave of the Future"? In any event, I hope the rest of the USENET folks who are employed by AT&T-<whatever> realize that providing that sort of information should more properly come from the Personnel Department rather than from individuals on the net. Cheers, Lindsay Lindsay Cleveland (...{ihnp4|mhux?|clyde}!akgua!glc) AT&T Technologies/Bell Laboratories ... Atlanta, Ga (404) 447-3909 ... Cornet 583-3909
sdyer@bbncca.ARPA (Steve Dyer) (01/02/84)
The tone of your response seems a little over-flaming. Rick Kiessig has been on the net for quite a while, though his present company is new. I also don't see what an individual company's policy regarding dial-in has to do with anything. Any directory has as much potential for abuse (witness the USENIX list of attendees) as for general good. If you are worried about headhunters, don't contribute. As it is, USENET is beginning to be so large, and it includes people of so many different skills, that a headhunter using a UUCP directory might have as much success as using the Manhattan phone book. The only item I can take issue with is Kiessig's request for other people's names at each site, something I wouldn't do without permission. -- /Steve Dyer decvax!bbncca!sdyer sdyer@bbncca
jeff@heurikon.UUCP (01/03/84)
Lindsay, I think you're overly concerned - boardering on paranoia.
A uucp directory would be nice since it would greatly ease the
ability to find a particular individual on the net AND find a
good path. I do agree, however, that personal or confidential
information (e.g., home telco or projects) should be given only
after careful consideration. I'm sure that sort of thing would
be optional, anyway. (Don't you think the headhunters already have
your number?)
--
Jeffrey Mattox, Heurikon Corp, Madison, WI
{harpo, hao, philabs}!seismo!uwvax!heurikon!jeff
(That path is correct, desipte what the headers might show.)mark@cbosgd.UUCP (Mark Horton) (01/04/84)
Lindsay did indeed overreact a bit, but he doesn't know Rick like I do. There are good points and bad points about Rick's directory proposal. First off, I should emphasize that you should (a) not include other people without asking their permission (it would certainly violate AT&T company policy for me to give out a list of employees), (b) don't list yourself unless you want to be listed in the directory. If you want to make it easy for people to find you, list yourself, if you want to remain anonymous, don't. Second, I can assure you that his "don't call me, I'll call you" policy is a temporary hardware problem. He has only four conductors going into the building, and one of them is being used for another phone line, leaving him with one line to use for both voice and dialup and dialout. It's just going to take awhile for the phone company to run in more wire. The line is used for voice during the day and dialout during certain times at night. We have our L.sys configured to call only between certain hours, if you really want to call him you can probably work out a similar arrangement. Finally, Rick Kiessig has been a part of Usenet for years, and was an active participant on the ARPANET in the days when it was the only true network. He's an OK person. However, I do want to make sure that everyone understands that Rick has started a money making venture, and he will be selling the directories he publishes for money. The UUCP map effort (which is currently getting organized) being undertaken by Rob Kolstad, Karen Summers-Horton, and some other good people, will be cooperating with Rick, and we'll be sharing data between us freely. Rick will in essence be adding value to the UUCP map. Mark Horton
seifert@ihuxl.UUCP (D.A. Seifert) (01/04/84)
Headhunters, you say? I received a Christmas card from a
headhunter this year. What will they think of next?
--
_____
/_____\ from the flying doghouse of
/_______\ Snoopy
|___|
____|___|_____ ihnp4!ihuxl!seifertgds@mit-eddie.UUCP (Greg Skinner) (01/13/84)
The ARPANET directory contains similar information to the proposed UUCP network directory. To be entered within it, I believe one must go through one's ARPANET liason to register. The liason sends the persons name, organization, phone # and net address to the NIC (Network Information Center). When the ARPANET directory comes out, for each person who was registered, their name, organization, net address, phone # (correct me, sdyer@bbncca if i'm wrong) and a unique ARPA code appears. I favor such a list because it is useful to ARPANET users who need to quickly get in touch with each other for business reasons. The key to the directory is that (1) only authorized ARPANET users are allowed to get on it (ie. no turists) and (2) one must go through two central authorities to be placed in the directory. If the UUCP network could adopt such a scheme, for example designating one person from each node (perhaps the site administrator) as the "UUCP liason", then have one node designated as the UUCP Network Information Center (suggestions anyone?), regular UUCP participants could be placed on the directory at the discretion of the site administrators and the UUCP NIC. Of course, the site administrators should *NOT* place anyone on the directory unknowingly or unwillingly. I disagree as does most anyone else with the proposal to volunteer names of other users of your machine. It is a definite invasion of privacy and the kind of thing Orwell was warning us about in 1984. Comments are welcome. -- --greg ...decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!gds (uucp) Gds@XX (arpa)