lipman@decwrl.UUCP (02/18/84)
From: closus::nerad
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<!>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
In response to Ariel's submission on the term "cocksucker" in which the point
is made that "cocksucker" should be discouraged as an expletive, since it
demeans women:
Since you seem to be assuming strongly heterosexual males (since
cocksucker is certainly not sex-specific to women in a world with free sexual
preference) then f* and f*er should also be included in your campaign. I
think the attempt is futile though.
I also know some large numbers of men and women who use f* and f*er as
expletives. I don't think that this trivializes sex any less, certainly, than
calling someone a cocksucker. If a straight woman uses f*er as an expletive,
does it demean men?
Oral sex among males has this wonderfully tittilating aspect of being
taboo (or was taboo, very short times ago), and something that *nice* girls
usually don't do, and *no* nice boys do. :-) However, getting head is
something devoutly to be wished, so to speak. Therefore, from desire and
repression comes a term used as an expletive.
It seems to me that if you examine the scatalogical terms of most
languages you will find that they generally refer to taboo items in the
culture of origination. Therefore, you will find scatalogical terms for feces
(sh*t), urine (piss), sex (f*, cocksucker, motherf*er...). General curses
(damnation, hell, may the bird of paradise...), and insults (your mother...,
who taught you to be so ugly or were you born like that...) tend to take more
thought and be used less often, unless like "damn" or "hell" they can be
condensed.
When I have children I intend to teach them to use more creative forms of
swearing, such as curses and insults. At least, if an individual takes time
to think up an insult or curse, they will: (A) possibly take time to cool
down; (B) THINK about the implications of what they are about to call
someone...assuming they are using the terms in anger.
I would make the point that in my generation, growing up in Central
Vermont, swearing of the standard sort was casual, and even affectionate.
Words that carried the stamp of mortal insult to my parents are bandied about
in design meetings at DEC with no more thought than using terms like "awesome"
"wicked" "fubar" (which has its own roots) and "rats." You specify that you
are speaking of "the worst thing" that someone could think of calling someone
else, but remember, fairly casual terms can be used nastily ("You louse!") or
"reserved words" be used affectionately ("...a cute little bastard.").
Shava Nerad
decvax!decwrl!rhea!closus!nerad
(P.S. for anyone who cares, this Shava is the diminuitive of Elisheva, the
biblical original of Elizabeth. I am most assuradly female, although I am
told that it is a man's name in some languages.)
From: ROLL::FEATHERSTON "Ed Featherston HLO1-1/P06 225-5241" 9-FEB-1984 17:12
To: CLOSUS::NERAD
Subj: ROLL::USENET no longer forwards articles
Attached find your recent submission to "net.women.only"
via ROLL::USENET.
Due to the ad-hoc way contributions from the ENET are set up,
there has been a large amount of confusion on the USENET as
to where our articles are coming from. This is even true if
you contribution directly to the newsgroup. The confusion
doubles if you contribute to ROLL::USENET, and it gets contributed
from there.
Due to this confusion, ROLL::USENET will no long forward articles
to the USENET. If you wish to contribute, you must do so directly
( read ROLL::ENETDIS.DOC for details on contributing directly ).
When contributing directly, please be sure to attach a valid
return mail address to your article ( again, due to the confusion,
it helps clarify who sent the message ). You will notice that
ROLL::USENET has already attached such an address to your article.
Let me know if you have any questions.
/ed featherston/
DEC Advanced Semiconductor Development Group
(ENET) ROLL::FEATHERSTON
(UUCP) {decvax, ucbvax, allegra}!decwrl!rhea!roll!featherston
(ARPA) decwrl!rhea!roll!featherston@Berkeley
decwrl!rhea!roll!featherston@SU-Shasta
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: USENET "USENET Newsgroup Distributor" 8-FEB-1984 11:26
To: USENET_DISTRIBUTOR
Subj: None
Begin Forwarded Message:
-------------------------------------------
Newsgroup : net.women.only
>From : CLOSUS::NERAD
Organization : Digital Equipment Corp.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<!>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
In response to Ariel's submission on the term "cocksucker" in which the point
is made that "cocksucker" should be discouraged as an expletive, since it
demeans women:
Since you seem to be assuming strongly heterosexual males (since
cocksucker is certainly not sex-specific to women in a world with free sexual
preference) then f* and f*er should also be included in your campaign. I
think the attempt is futile though.
I also know some large numbers of men and women who use f* and f*er as
expletives. I don't think that this trivializes sex any less, certainly, than
calling someone a cocksucker. If a straight woman uses f*er as an expletive,
does it demean men?
Oral sex among males has this wonderfully tittilating aspect of being
taboo (or was taboo, very short times ago), and something that *nice* girls
usually don't do, and *no* nice boys do. :-) However, getting head is
something devoutly to be wished, so to speak. Therefore, from desire and
repression comes a term used as an expletive.
It seems to me that if you examine the scatalogical terms of most
languages you will find that they generally refer to taboo items in the
culture of origination. Therefore, you will find scatalogical terms for feces
(sh*t), urine (piss), sex (f*, cocksucker, motherf*er...). General curses
(damnation, hell, may the bird of paradise...), and insults (your mother...,
who taught you to be so ugly or were you born like that...) tend to take more
thought and be used less often, unless like "damn" or "hell" they can be
condensed.
When I have children I intend to teach them to use more creative forms of
swearing, such as curses and insults. At least, if an individual takes time
to think up an insult or curse, they will: (A) possibly take time to cool
down; (B) THINK about the implications of what they are about to call
someone...assuming they are using the terms in anger.
I would make the point that in my generation, growing up in Central
Vermont, swearing of the standard sort was casual, and even affectionate.
Words that carried the stamp of mortal insult to my parents are bandied about
in design meetings at DEC with no more thought than using terms like "awesome"
"wicked" "fubar" (which has its own roots) and "rats." You specify that you
are speaking of "the worst thing" that someone could think of calling someone
else, but remember, fairly casual terms can be used nastily ("You louse!") or
"reserved words" be used affectionately ("...a cute little bastard.").
Shava Nerad
decvax!decwrl!rhea!closus!nerad
(P.S. for anyone who cares, this Shava is the diminuitive of Elisheva, the
biblical original of Elizabeth. I am most assuradly female, although I am
told that it is a man's name in some languages.)
(UUCP) {decvax, ucbvax, allegra}!decwrl!rhea!closus!nerad
(ARPA) decwrl!rhea!closus!nerad@Berkeley
decwrl!rhea!closus!nerad@SU-Shasta
-------------------------------------------
End Forwarded Message