tk@ecn-ee.UUCP (06/08/84)
#R:gargoyle:-14500:ecn-ee:18200004:000:1683
ecn-ee!tk Jun 8 09:57:00 1984
_
Whether the driver uses his turn signal in a situation like the one you
described is really beside the point. If you were in a car, wouldn't
you think it incredible if somebody passed you on the left and then
turned right, even if they were signaling? One of my early experiences
with cyclist-meets-right-turning-car did not have such a gentle
ending. I never had a chance to see if the driver was signaling or
not. I was about 15 feet from a busy intersection traveling at around
20mph when a car passing me on the left began to turn right when it was
directly beside me. I was pinned against the side of the car before
there was any chance to react, the next thing I knew I was on the
ground. The driver never stopped, and probably never heard or saw me
from inside their air-conditioned dinosaur. Even then I knew enough to
put myself further out into the lane than usual when approaching an
intersection, but I wasn't obtrusive enough to keep this driver(?) from
getting around. I don't think it was somebody that was intentionally
trying to run me down, it's just that I was on a bicycle so it didn't
really matter. Cyclists are put into this situation so often that the
point can't really can't be made strong enough: when you're approaching
an intersection, GET OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE LANE. I'm not sure if
you can get far enough out to keep some people from trying to get
around you (ever seen someone make a right turn from the left lane on a
4-lane road?), but try. You may piss off a lot of drivers, but it's
your right to protect yourself from them.
--------
Tom Kirk
UUCP: {allegra|decvax|harpo|ihnp4|teklabs|ucbvax}!pur-ee!tk
ARPA: pur-ee!tk@berkeley.arpadave@zinfandel.UUCP (06/10/84)
#R:gargoyle:-14500:zinfandel:20500004:000:1358
zinfandel!dave Jun 8 09:57:00 1984
It is indeed very tempting to 'be articulate' with motorists that
have shown a lack of good judgement. It has been my experience,
however, that all this serves is to make the both of you angrier
and more prone to do the same thing next time.
On those rare occasions where I have the opportunity to speak with
an offending driver, I try to be civil and tactfully point out the
error of his/her ways. This approach almost never results in an
apology, but hopefully the driver will walk/drive away with a little
better understanding (after thinking about it for a while).
Being hostile only illicits a hostile response -- that is perfectly
natural human behavior. Chances are excellent that they will 'do it
again' next time, if for no other reason than increased hostility
towards bicyclists in general.
This approach, of course, could only work with people who show a basic
lack of good judgement, as opposed to people who are downright malicious
(beer bottle throwers, people who deliberately run you off the road).
As you point out, there is nothing you can do with this sort anyway,
so why rise to the bait and give them the one finger salute? This
only heightens their satisfaction.
Dave Funk
Zehntel, Inc.
2625 Shadelands Drive
Walnut Creek, CA 92598
(415) 932-6900 x309
....!decvax!sytek!zehntel!dave
...."zehntel!dave"@BERKELEYciampa@wivax.UUCP (06/14/84)
Ah!!!! The missing turn signal. I had an elderly gentleman
pass me on a turn and then take a quick right, no blinker
of course. I found myself heading straight for the car with
no way out. Just before the moment of impact, I dove sideways
off the bike and landed on the sidewalk, scratched and sore.
I looked up only to see my $500 Fuji laying underneath the
car. The man got out of the car and examined his car with
me laying on the ground. I hopped up and screamed "Where
the #$%^& was your blinker?!?!" He said that he had it on,
but that was until the witnesses came and proved him wrong.
Needless to say, I threatened him with a lawsuit until he
decided to pay for the cost of the bicycle. I did gain two
valuable lessons: Make yourself visible (i.e. don't ride
to close to the side of the road), and make sure you wear
a helmet (I was not, but I had a *lucky* fall).
--
Robert A. Ciampa {apollo, cadmus, decvax, linus, masscomp}!wivax!ciampa
Wang Institute (617) 649-9731 x372furuta@uw-june (Richard Furuta) (06/21/84)
Well, I hate to say it, but I've found that other bicyclists are often as much of a problem as are inconsiderate car drivers. Admittedly most of my riding these days are on bike paths rather than on streets so my interactions with cars are blisfully limited. There are two kinds of bicyclists who have caused me problems: those who think they are such hot shots that they don't bother to pay attention to any conditions around them and those who are so oblivious that they are unable to pay attention to their surrounding conditions. In the first category are all those guys in the funny outfits who decide to pass slower traffic at high speeds without bothering to check first for oncoming traffic. In the second category is the wonderful fellow who moved over to the far left when I called out that I wanted to pass and then made a sharp right turn directly into my path (I had to bail out over that one). Let me for the moment take the viewpoint of a car driver and list some recent bicyclist behavior I've seen that would tend to make the car driver feel less kindly about the bicyclist. - bicyclist runs a red light - bicyclists ride the wrong way down a road into oncoming traffic - bicyclist stops immediately behind a standard transmission car on a very steep hill and leans on the back of the car - bicyclists riding between lanes of traffic (the complaint about cars opening doors from the left kind of implies that the bike might have not been in a legitimate lane to begin with). The point here is that certainly there are many instances where cars ignore bicyclists' rights and bicyclists do have the right to claim those rights through manouvers like moving into the center of their lane. However there are also many cases where bicyclists fail to properly respect the rights of the others on the road (other bicycles and cars both). I think that the irresponsible behavior of some bicyclists is probably directly responsible for the lack of respect afforded to all bicyclists by some people. --Rick
ciampa@wivax.UUCP (Robert Ciampa) (06/27/84)
To take Rick's point a bit further:
I was in my car taking a right turn through a green light.
Suddenly, a 'cyclist'--no, bicycle rider, nearly gets hit by
my fender (now I can see why many motorists hate cyclists).
This person on the bicycle was (1) on the wrong side of
the road, (2) going through a red light, (3) had walkmans
on, and (4) was carrying a six-pack with one hand and
attempting to steer with the other. It's too bad that
people like this are responsible for many motorists anger
toward us. I think that the only solution will come when
a motorist can differentiate between a cyclist, and a
bicycle rider.
-----------------
p.s. Massachusetts cyclists: any info on the Charles River
Wheelmen?
--
Robert A. Ciampa {apollo, cadmus, decvax, linus, masscomp}!wivax!ciampa
Wang Institute (617) 649-9731 x372kjell@wisc-ai.ARPA (06/30/84)
Robert Ciamp's comment (about the person on a bicycle going the wrong way, with a Walkman on, and a six pack in one hand...) brings up an important point to anyone considering buying a helmet: There IS a way for motorists to tell the difference between a person who happens to be on a bicycle and a bicyclist. Bicyclists wear helmets. I've noticed a difference in the way cars behave on days I don't wear a helmet. They seem less inclined to take me seriously. I can't say for sure if this is merely because the helmet (mine is a Bell, white with red stripes) is more visible, or because they have experienced serious cyclists before with helmets on (by serious I mean someone who uses lanes like a car, and goes fast and straight enough not to be an extreme aggravation). So there is a reason to buy a helmet even if you never expect to need it: just its presence may prevent an accident.
lab@qubix.UUCP (Q-Bick) (07/02/84)
Riding home from work last Wednesday, I got the hassle from a couple of
cars. One guy seemed like he was coming into my lane (from the other
direction) just to get me - I went through the nearest driveway. The guy
had no excuse for not seeing me, my reflective helmet or my light. When
there's a headlight beam on either side of my wheel, *then* I worry.
The (female) occupants of another car gave me some sort of flirtatious
"Hey guy!" complete with whistles. I've heard gals going crazy over guys
in uniform, but just over a helmet? (I might have understood had I been
wearing cycling shorts or a fancy shirt...)
--
The Ice Floe of Larry Bickford
{ihnp4,allegra,ucbvax}!{amd70,decwrl,sun}!qubix!lab
"When the English language gets in my way, I walk over it." - Billy Sundayjpj@mss.UUCP (J. P. Jenal) (07/03/84)
As someone who was recently forced to run for my life from a couple of jerks in a car as I rode home, allow me to simply say that a driver in a car can demand his rights - all I can try to do is stay alive. The next time you are driving along in several thousands of pounds of steel, have some pity on the poor guy wheeling along on 24 pounds of alloy. -- Cheers... Jim Jenal (aka ...!scgvaxd!mss!jpj) Mayfield Senior School ( " ...!ihnp4!mss!jpj)