freb@ittvax.UUCP (Karl Freburger) (02/14/84)
Yes, Apple does have a Smalltalk on the Lisa. No, they don't want to sell it. Last year I spent considerable time trying to convince Apple to sell their Smalltalk, but they weren't interested. Guess they thought it might cut into their sales of Lisa software. I even tried to convince the guy in charge of software products for the Lisa that they should offer Smalltalk as an unsupported product - anything to get it out where I could buy it. Last week a colleague of mine was at a Mac demo and asked again. The Apple-rep there said they were just going to leave the Smalltalk market to Xerox. What they don't seem to realize is that there are people out here (like me) who won't buy a Lisa (or even recommend anyone else buy a Lisa) unless I can have Smalltalk on it. They're missing an opportunity to get a foot in the door here. Oh, well, maybe if everyone out there keeps asking, they'll get the idea. Personally I'd rather spend my company's bucks at a place where they want to sell Smalltalk. If only I could find one... Karl Freburger (decvax!ittvax!freb)
mark@harvard.UUCP (Mark Lentczner) (02/14/84)
<hi there blank line eater...> I would be most happy if Apple would release their SmallTalk for the Lisa (and/or Mac) even without support. Is it possible that we could flood Apple with requests, or perhaps a more organized effort? I will gladly compile a list of people who want SmallTalk for the Lisa/Mac and write several letters to Apple. Any bites? -Mark Lentczner Electronic Music Studio Music Department Harvard University Cambridge, MA 02138 decvax!genrad!wjh12!harvard!mark via UUCP
rentsch@unc.UUCP (Tim Rentsch) (02/15/84)
(Note: Not an advertisement.) You can buy a machine that runs Smalltalk, if you want. From Xerox Special Information Systems (last I checked), in Pasadena, CA. [The machines are Xerox D-series machines.] Tim
edhall@randvax.ARPA (Ed Hall) (02/17/84)
------------------------------ By all means, yes! Why, I'd even consider buying a Lisa on the basis of it running Smalltalk, alone... (if the implementation was reasonable). If Apple gets the idea that there are enough of us that feel this way, they'll doubtless feel more positive about releasing Smalltalk. -Ed Hall decvax!randvax!edhall
darrelj@sdcrdcf.UUCP (Darrel VanBuer) (02/19/84)
It's true Xerox will sell you machines and Smalltalk, but the price is
completely out of the league of a Lisa.
Xerox 1100 (Dolphin) $45,000
1132 (Dorado) $129,000 (the fastest Smalltalk machine in the world)
Plus $5000 for the Smalltalk software (if you really didn't want Interlisp
it's conceivable some adjustment would be possible).
--
Darrel J. Van Buer, PhD
System Development Corp.
2500 Colorado Ave
Santa Monica, CA 90406
(213)820-4111 x5449
...{allegra,burdvax,cbosgd,hplabs,ihnp4,sdccsu3,trw-unix}!sdcrdcf!darrelj
VANBUER@USC-ECL.ARPAobrien@randvax.ARPA (Michael O'Brien) (02/25/84)
I have heard that the real reason Apple doesn't want to sell Smalltalk on the Lisa is that it runs at about 5% of the speed of the (standalone) implementation Peter Deutsch did for the Sun workstation. If you want a 68000-based Smalltalk engine you're probably better off talking to Sun (except that their marketing division [at least] appears to have serious problems doing things like returning phone calls).
edhall@randvax.ARPA (Ed Hall) (02/27/84)
---------------------------------- We *have* Xerox Dolphins here. At $45,000 a throw they are hardly my idea of a personal computer. And they are none too speedy at running Smalltalk (which doesn't keep me from liking it). -Ed Hall decvax!randvax!edhall