[net.bizarre] more on lost positives

barth@tellab1.UUCP (Barth Richards) (09/13/85)

In regards to the net discussion of "lost positives":

This is, in fact, an actual phenomenon. One example is indeed "uncouth."
In Anglo-Saxon (the English language as spoken in England from circa 500 A.D.
to circa 1100 A.D.) the verb "cann" or "cunnan" (there is some dispute as to
what the proper infinitive was) meant "to know, to know how, to be able to."*
It is from this word that we get the modern English verb "can."

The adjective formed from this verb was "cuth" (actually spelt:

                                         # #
                                          #
                                         # #
                                            #
                            ###   #   #    ###
                           #      #   #   #   #
                           #      #   #   #   #
                            ###    ###     ###

the funny looking "d" with a crossed stem was pronounced as a "th" sound)
The adjective meant "known, familiar, well known."* The negative form was,
you guessed it (Don, please tell our lovely contestants what they have won),
"uncuth," which meant "unknown, unfriendly, unkind."*

One can see where the modern meaning of "uncouth" ("uncultured, crude"@)
came from. In the dark ages, travel was a rare occurance. People tended to
to know everyone they met. With most people never going much more than
a few miles from where they lived, this is easy to understand, because almost
everyone one met almost certianly lived within a small geographic area.
Therefore, anyone who was unfamiliar probably would have been from a town
isome distance away, and so the stranger would be an "unknown" and his ways
would doubtlessly seem strange--somehow unwholesome--REEKING OF COMMUNIST
INFILTRATION!!!!!!!!
(Never mind the fact that Marx and Engles would not be born for another
thousand and some odd years. Never underestimate the cunning of those pinko
bastards! They're everywhere! Holding peace rallies and flouridating our
water!...........I seem to have strayed somewhat from my original wagon
train of thought....Oh yes, UNCOUTH, like those Godless, red-commie, satanic-
demons-who-put-all-those-backward-messages-in-those-evil-rock-and-roll-records,
Lenin-loving, hippie freaks.)

But the point is that their ways would seem improper, and so "unknown" people,
especially "unfriendly, unkind, unknown" people and their ways were thought of
as uncultured as a result of ignorance. Hence the relationship:

		  unknown----------------->uncultured.

Interestingly enough, the word "couth" is in the Dictionary, with the
definition "sophisticated, polished." The really BIZARRE part is that this
word "couth" is a backformation from "uncouth" and appeared about 1896.
So a lost positive was reinstated in the language quite by accident, and is
now on the way out again. (I mean, how many of you out there in netland use
the word "couth" in daily conversation?)



* from A STUDENT'S DICTIONARY OF ANGLO-SAXON
@ from WEBSTER'S NEW WORLD DICTIONARY


				   Barth Richards
				   Tellabs, Inc.
				   Lisle, IL

				   "Ford, do you realize that robot
				    can hum like Pink Floyd."
                                   -Ford Prefect

brad@SU-ISL.ARPA (09/17/85)

In article <581@tellab1.UUCP> barth@tellab3.UUCP (Barth Richards) writes:
>In regards to the net discussion of "lost positives":
>
>		[etc]
>
>But the point is that their ways would seem improper, and so "unknown" people,
>especially "unfriendly, unkind, unknown" people and their ways were thought of
>as uncultured as a result of ignorance. Hence the relationship:
>
>		  unknown----------------->uncultured.
>
>Interestingly enough, the word "couth" is in the Dictionary, with the
>definition "sophisticated, polished." The really BIZARRE part is that this
>word "couth" is a backformation from "uncouth" and appeared about 1896.
>So a lost positive was reinstated in the language quite by accident, and is
>now on the way out again. (I mean, how many of you out there in netland use
>the word "couth" in daily conversation?)

I remember when I was a sousaphone player in the marching band at Ohio State
seeing a sign written by other band members demanding:


1)  Some f***ing couth for the 'basses' [Sousaphone players]


well, 

I thought that was kind of a bizarre choice of words.  Given the reputation of 
the sousaphone section at the time, I was never sure whether that f-word was
intended as a modifier or simply an expletive...

...now a semi-retired tuba player


brad clymer