eliz@rochester.UUCP (Elizabeth Hinkelman) (06/29/84)
The book that Alan Algustyniak is interested in is by Julian Jaynes:
"The Origins of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind."
It makes for very interesting reading, but my impression is that most
psychologists are skeptical of it. This is in part because Jaynes dates
the origins of human consciousness as within the last few millennia (much
later than does generally accepted theory), and partly because, as my
psycholinguistics prof said, "Isn't Jaynes lucky to be a social psychologist,
who can afford to speculate?" No offense to social psych intended; the
point is that the work in question is of a speculative nature.
Several of us at the U of Rochester are reading "Origins" or will be soon.
I, for one, would be interested in further discussion.
Elizabeth Hinkelman (eliz@Rochester)hutch@shark.UUCP (Stephen Hutchison) (07/12/84)
<bi cameras? Kinky!> Does anyone who read the book know how Jaynes handles the Hindu religion, which clearly deals with ideas of consciousness? Or the Tao, or the teachings of Confucius, which (if I recall correctly) also deal with these concepts? All three are rather older than 2000 years. Hutch
alan@sdcrdcf.UUCP (07/12/84)
<I am dreaming all this> I think it's a good idea to discuss consciousness and its origins. But net.books is not the place. Since there is no net.psychology nor net.behavior, i have started the discussion in net.philosophy. See you there! alan
west@sdcsla.UUCP (07/13/84)
My recollection from reading Jaynes' book nearly a decade ago is that he does not deal with Hindu or Chinese philosophy or religion, and this was one of the many disappointing points in the book. I did find it amusing and provocative, and I think there is a real place for speculative-non-fiction books. Such books may force people to re-examine their thoughts to come up with good reasons for believing or disbelieving in particular theories -- and that sort of process never hurts (within limit). So, even though I can't recommend the book as a book of science, it is worth reading if you have some spare time. Think of it as speculative fiction, if you like. -- Larry West, UC San Diego, Institute for Cognitive Science -- decvax!ittvax!dcdwest!sdcsvax!sdcsla!west -- ucbvax!sdcsvax!sdcsla!west -- west@NPRDC
kmo@ptsfa.UUCP (Ken Olsen) (07/14/84)
<>
I am currently (07/13/84 1503 PDT) 2/3 of the way through
with "The Origin of Consciousness ...". I find it quite
intriguing and not implausible. After reading some of
Jaynes' speculations, I find myself with my mouth open - quite
a bit of it really makes sense.
If this book is taken the way Darwin's "Origin of
Species" and "Descent of Man" were, I can't wait to see what
the Creationists will have to say.
I shouldn't say more until I've finished. So until then...
Ken Olsen
{ihnp4,ucbvax,cbosgd,decwrl,amd70,fortune,zehntel}!dual!ptsfa!kmo