showard@udenva.UUCP (showard) (04/26/85)
[It's not a bug; it's a feature!] I haven't been flamed in awhile, so here goes: Why do you all have this fascination with Sherlock Holmes?? I can't imagine, unless you're fans of bad writing, incredibly bad dialogue, inhuman characters, and unbelievable plots. Is it because you haven't read any of the Doyle stories since you were twelve and this is just nostalgia? Don't start telling me about "the first mysteries" or "the first detective stories" because Poe did those. (He even did the first "open" mystery--almost never seen--"The Man of the Crowd") And don't tell me how brilliant Holmes is, because the man does nothing but make wild guesses that turn out to be right and pull rabbits out of his hat (Do you really believe that it is possible to identify a brand of tobacco by the ashes? In heaven's name, how?). I think you should all go and read some modern mysteries, or if you must live in the past some vintage Christies and Queens. Leave Holmes for the twelve-year-olds. --Steve Blore, in-house detective, KAOS Radio, U of Denver
kayvan@ucbvax.ARPA (Kayvan Aghaiepour) (04/28/85)
In article <552@udenva.UUCP> showard@udenva.UUCP (showard) writes: > > I haven't been flamed in awhile, so here goes: Why do you all have this >fascination with Sherlock Holmes?? [...] Is it because you haven't read >any of the Doyle stories since you were twelve and this is just nostalgia? > >[...] > >Leave Holmes for the twelve-year-olds. > >--Steve Blore, in-house detective, KAOS Radio, U of Denver I agree with him wholeheartedly!! Down with Sherlock Holmes!! ---Kayvan
cja@lzwi.UUCP (C.E.JACKSON) (05/07/85)
> I haven't been flamed in awhile, so here goes: Why do you all have this > fascination with Sherlock Holmes?? I can't imagine, unless you're fans of > bad writing, incredibly bad dialogue, inhuman characters, and unbelievable > plots. Is it because you haven't read any of the Doyle stories since you > were twelve and this is just nostalgia? I read Sherlock Holmes just the other day--which is to say that I read it when I was on the verge of 27...I found it quite enjoyable. I like 19th Century English fiction, I like books I don't have to think about very deeply, & in mysteries, I don't mind "stock" characters. Nobody said ever said (I hope!) that every book one read had to be a piece of literary art on the par with Jane Austen's. > Don't start telling me about "the first mysteries" or "the first detective > stories" because Poe did those. No, you're right--there were other mystery writers...some before Poe even, but Conan Doyle set the tone for the British ratiocination variety, which many people enjoy. I far prefer it to the American "hard-boiled" variety. > I think you should all go and read some modern mysteries, or if you must > live in the past some vintage Christies and Queens. What, we SHOULDN'T read Conan Doyle? Smacks a tad of censorship. Perhaps you just wish people wouldn't talk about him so much. Fine. Which modern author do you like best? In what ways do you think modern authors surpass Holmes or Christie or Queen (or Sayers or Marsh or Tey?) What do you look for when you read a mystery? What do you object to most in a mystery? How much are you willing to suspend disbelief in when reading a mystery--that is, you don't buy the idea of recognizing ashes--what will you allow? > --Steve Blore, in-house detective, KAOS Radio, U of Denver C. E. Jackson ...ihnp4!lznv!cja (for reasons too silly to explain,the address above [lzwi] is incorrect--don't use it)
al@mot.UUCP (Al Filipski) (10/20/85)
-
I have recently become addicted to Sherlock Holmes stories. I got
into the habit of reading one before going to bed. The problem is,
I have RUN OUT OF STORIES. I have read all of Arthur Conan Doyle's
Sherlock Holmes stories (56 of them, I believe). I have heard that
others after Conan Doyle also wrote Sherlock Holmes stories. Is this
true? Does anyone know the names of any authors or collections of
Holmes stories besides Doyle's? Are they faithful to the Doyle
style and characterizations? Any other information about Holmes
would be appreciated. I have heard that there is an organization
called the "Baker Street Irregulars" that is sort of a Holmes fan
club. What do they do? Are there any members reading this?
Before reading the stories, my perception of Holmes was
largely shaped by the Rathbone/Bruce movies. I now realize that
they are far from being true to the original characterizations.
Watson, In particular, is not the fool portrayed by Nigel Bruce.
The PBS "Mystery" series of Holmes stories, on the contrary, were
absolutely true to the original. I was also surprized to see that
Moriarty only appears in two or three of the original stories.
The popular association seems to be that Holmes is continually
battling Moriarty.
Anyway, I would be interested in any other comments or
pointers to other information or stories about Holmes.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alan Filipski, UNIX group, Motorola Microsystems, Tempe, AZ U.S.A
{seismo|ihnp4}!ut-sally!oakhill!mot!al | ucbvax!arizona!asuvax!mot!al
------------------------------------------------------------------------steiner@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU (Dave Steiner) (10/24/85)
> From: al@mot.UUCP (Al Filipski) > Message-ID: <405@mot.UUCP> > Date: 20 Oct 85 02:57:07 GMT > > I have recently become addicted to Sherlock Holmes stories. I got > into the habit of reading one before going to bed. The problem is, > I have RUN OUT OF STORIES. I have read all of Arthur Conan Doyle's > Sherlock Holmes stories (56 of them, I believe). Actually there are 60. 56 short stories and 4 novels. If you're lucky, you still have 4 more to go...if not, oh well. > I have heard that > others after Conan Doyle also wrote Sherlock Holmes stories. Is this > true? Does anyone know the names of any authors or collections of > Holmes stories besides Doyle's? Are they faithful to the Doyle > style and characterizations? Well, there are quite a few books by other authors. Some are ok, most are not that great, none are quite as good as ACD. Below is a list of the ones that I know of. The ones that are *'ed are ones that I liked or that have been recommended to me. > Any other information about Holmes > would be appreciated. I have heard that there is an organization > called the "Baker Street Irregulars" that is sort of a Holmes fan > club. What do they do? Are there any members reading this? I'm not a member of the BSI but I do subscribe to the Baker Street Journal. It is a quarterly journal with articles ranging from pastiches to "scholarly research" to tidbits of news. To subscribe ($12.50/yr) write to Fordham University Press University Box L Bronx, NY 10458 BTW, there are quite a few Sherlockian Societies (Scions) throughout the country (and the world). Most of them are local (the BSI is not) and get together for a dinner, talks, and fun about twice a year. If you let me know where you are from, I could probably get you an address of the nearest one. > Before reading the stories, my perception of Holmes was > largely shaped by the Rathbone/Bruce movies. I now realize that > they are far from being true to the original characterizations. > Watson, In particular, is not the fool portrayed by Nigel Bruce. > The PBS "Mystery" series of Holmes stories, on the contrary, were > absolutely true to the original. I agree 100%. > I was also surprized to see that > Moriarty only appears in two or three of the original stories. > The popular association seems to be that Holmes is continually > battling Moriarty. > Anyway, I would be interested in any other comments or > pointers to other information or stories about Holmes. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Alan Filipski, UNIX group, Motorola Microsystems, Tempe, AZ U.S.A > {seismo|ihnp4}!ut-sally!oakhill!mot!al | ucbvax!arizona!asuvax!mot!al > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Here is the list of SH books by other authors. There are probably more around that I don't know of (if you know of any, let me know). The Pandora Plague - Lee A. Matthias * The Giant Rat of Sumatra - Richard L. Boyer The Last Sherlock Holmes Story - Michael Dibdin * Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Holmes - Loren D. Estleman * Sherlock Holmes vs Dracula - Loren D. Estleman * Enter the Lion - Michael P. Hodel and Sean M. Wright * The Seven-Per-Cent Solution - Nicholas Meyer * The West End Horror - Nicholas Meyer * The Holmes-Dracula File - Fred Saberhagen Exit Sherlock Holmes - Robert Lee Hall Sherlock Holmes and the Golden Bird - Frank Thomas Sherlock Holmes and the Sacred Sword - Frank Thomas Sherlock Holmes and the Treasure Train - Frank Thomas Sherlock Holmes, Bridge Detective - Frank Thomas bridge games by Holmes/Watson and a few small mysteries. The Infernal Device - Michael Kurland * Death by Gaslight - Michael Kurland * The Return of Moriarty - John Gardner * The Revenge of Moriarty - John Gardner * Prisoner Of The Devil - Michael Hardwick * The Private Life of Dr. Watson - Michael Hardwick * Sherlock Holmes: My Life and Crimes - Michael Hardwick Sherlock Holmes Through Time & Space - eds. Asimov, Greenburg and Waugh * The Exploits of Sherlock Holmes - Adrian C. Doyle & John D. Carr * Sherlock Holmes: The Published Apocrypha - Ed. Jack Tracy The Truthful Lady - J. Storer Clouston The Adventure of the Purple Hand - "ed by" D. O. Smith The Adventure of the Unseen Traveller - "ed by" D. O. Smith The Adventure of the Peerless Peer - Philip Jose Farmer * The Memoirs of Schlock Holmes - Robert Fish Sherlock Holmes in New York - D.R. Benson The Adventures of Creighton Holmes - Ned Hubbell Copper Beeches - Arthur Lewis The Earthquake Machine - Austin Mitchelson; Nicholas Utechin Hellbirds - Austin Mitchelson; Nicholas Utechin Sherlock Holmes's War of the Worlds - Manly Wellman; Wade Wellman The Martian Crown Jewels - Poul Anderson A short story in "A Treasury of Great Science Fiction", volume 1 edited by Anthony Boucher. The Case of the Philosopher's Ring - Collins Randall Their Majesties' Bucketeers - L. Neil Smith The Amazing Mycroft Mysteries - F.F. Heard A trilogy of A Taste for Honey, Reply Paid & The Notched Hairpin. Ten Years Beyond Baker Street - Cay Van Ash Murder Most Irregular - H. Paul Jeffers The Case Of The Baker Street Irregulars - Anthony Boucher Basil of Baker Street (and related titles) - Eve Titus The Case of the Ectoplasmic Man - ??? The Mycroft Memoranda - Ray Walsh The Case of the Revolutionist's Daughter - Lewis S. Feuer * The Adventures of Solar Pons (#1) - August Derleth * The Chronicles of Solar Pons (#2) - August Derleth * The Memoirs of Solar Pons (#3) - August Derleth * The Casebook of Solar Pons (#4) - August Derleth * The Reminiscences of Solar Pons (#5) - August Derleth * The Return of Solar Pons (#6) - August Derleth * Mr. Fairlie's Final Journey (#7) - August Derleth * The Dossier of Solar Pons (#8) - Basil Copper * The Further Adventures of Solar Pons (#9) - Basil Copper * The Secret Files of Solar Pons (#10) - Basil Copper * The Uncollected Cases of Solar Pons (#11) - Basil Copper Three Problems for Solar Pons - August Derleth (these were included in The Return of Solar Pons) A Praed Street Dossier - August Derleth (not sure if this is included in others, or is new material) The Misadventures of Sherlock Holmes - ed by Ellery Queen (1944) The Science-Fictional Sherlock Holmes - ed by Norman Metcalf * The Final Adventures of Sherlock Holmes - by Sir Arthur C. Doyle, collected by Peter Haining A Study in Terror - Ellery Queen Trouble in Bugland - William Kotzwinkle Death of a Scavenger - Keith Spore Baker Street - Jerome Coppersmith (Text to the musical) For a lot of reprints and interesting Holmes studies: Magico Magazine PO Box 156 NY, NY 10002 Hope this all helps. Let me know if you have any other questions. -- ds uucp: ...{harvard, seismo, ut-sally, sri-iu, ihnp4!packard}!topaz!steiner arpa: Steiner@RUTGERS
rose@sdcsvax.UUCP (Dan Rose) (10/25/85)
In article <405@mot.UUCP> al@mot.UUCP (Al Filipski) writes: >- >I have recently become addicted to Sherlock Holmes stories. . . >Does anyone know the names of any authors or collections of >Holmes stories besides Doyle's? Are they faithful to the Doyle >style and characterizations? I am also a Holmes fan, although it's been a while since I've read the stories. A recent non-Doyle Holmes book I enjoyed was _The Seven Percent Solution_ by Nicholas Meyer, which came out sometime in the 70s and was also made into a movie. It's about Holmes cocaine addiction, among other things, and includes appearances by Sigmund Freud AND Prof. Moriarty, whose identity and background is explained. It's also all done in a very Doyle-like style; I seem to remember the critics all being very impressed with this. Nicholas Meyer, the author, apparently had read a lot of other people's attempts at "new" Holmes stories, and was convinced he could do better. A couple years later, he saw "Star Trek: The Motion Picture" and felt the same way. He went on to direct "The Wrath of Khan." His commitment to original style was pretty evident there, and he apparently screened all 75 or so episodes of the Star Trek series before planning the direction of "Khan". But this discussion is drifting away from books. -- Dan (not Broadway Danny) Rose rose@UCSD
kayuucee@cvl.UUCP (Kenneth W. Crist Jr.) (10/29/85)
Another book to add to the Sherlock Holmes list is: The Adventure of Sherlock Holmes Smarter Brother by Gilbert Pearlman. This is the book adaptation of the movie by the same name with Gene Wilder. Kenneth Crist kayuucee@cvl
kato@utcsri.UUCP (John Kitamura) (10/30/85)
> Here is the list of SH books by other authors. There are probably > more around that I don't know of (if you know of any, let me know). There are also a few ACD mystery stories which have a `Holmes-like' character, and a couple SH plays written by ACD. These are available in a couple collections: `The Uncollected Sherlock Holmes', a Penguin paperback, `Completing the Canon' (hardcover - can't remember the publisher) and `The Uncollected (I think) Apocrypha'. These all contain the stage plays `The Crown Diamond (The Mazarin Stone)', `The Speckled Band', and the Apocrypha also has the ACD/William Gillete written `Sherlock Holmes' (which was revived on Broadway in the late 70's). The stories are generally inferior, but its been a while since I have read them, so I'm a bit fuzzy in the details. John Kitamura UUCP: {decvax,linus,ihnp4,uw-beaver,allegra,utzoo}!utcsri!kato
leiby@masscomp.UUCP (Mike Leibensperger) (11/27/85)
If you are a chess player, there is an interesting set of rather
non-traditional chess problems called _The_Chess_Mysteries_of_
_Sherlock_Holmes, by Raymond Smullyan, a professor of mathematical
logic at SUNY Buffalo. It's a lot of fun!
--
Rt. Rev. Mike Leibensperger, Archbishop of Chelmsford
Church of St. Clint the Righteous ("Feel lucky, Pink Boy?")
Masscomp; 1 Technology Park; Westford, MA 01886
{decvax,ihnp4,tektronix}!masscomp!leibycolonel@sunybcs.UUCP (Col. G. L. Sicherman) (12/01/85)
> If you are a chess player, there is an interesting set of rather > non-traditional chess problems called _The_Chess_Mysteries_of_ > _Sherlock_Holmes, by Raymond Smullyan, a professor of mathematical > logic at SUNY Buffalo. It's a lot of fun! Not here, but at Lehman College, CUNY. Most of the problems involve retrograde analysis. -- Col. G. L. Sicherman UU: ...{rocksvax|decvax}!sunybcs!colonel CS: colonel@buffalo-cs BI: csdsicher@sunyabva
msb@lsuc.UUCP (Mark Brader) (12/03/85)
Mike Leibensperger (leiby@masscomp.UUCP) writes: > If you are a chess player, there is an interesting set of rather > non-traditional chess problems called _The_Chess_Mysteries_of_ > _Sherlock_Holmes, by Raymond Smullyan, ... Non-traditional indeed. I enjoyed these, but the reason is that they don't really demand much chess skill, only logical skill and a knowledge of the moves. The problems tend to be of this form: "Given that in the indicated position none of the knights have moved, prove that it is White's move" or "...prove that White cannot castle". Probably not the sort of thing that net.games.chess readers will really go for. (I've added a cross-posting to net.puzzle which I think is appropriate.) Also, I found about 10 bugs in the book. However, if there has been a new edition since I got it, things could have improved. Mark Brader