[net.religion] Religionism, Humanism, and Belief systems

israel@umcp-cs.UUCP (11/07/83)

	From: CSvax:Pucc-H:aeq@pur-ee.UUCP

	God has been known to work through many people who don't acknowledge a
	relationship to him (as witness numerous "secular" songs which have
	obvious religious overtones, such as an early Billy Joel song entitled
	"You're My Home" or something similar).

Oh, I love the above line!  One thing that is a basic problem with
arguments/discussions/debates on a newsgroup like this is that
all the beliefs are so in-bred that everyone sees the world
through <belief>-colored glasses.  The comment in the above paragraph
is about "obvious religious overtones", but personally, when I
hear the song "You're My Home" it comes across to me as non-religious
and also with some humanistic overtones.  In fact, very often I will
look at / read / listen to something religious and notice many
humanistic overtones.

Especially on a forum like this, people have to be very careful to
realize when their beliefs are getting in the way of the actual
facts.  I've always found it fairly amazing (and a little humorous)
how two people with totally polarized viewpoints on a subject can
look at the same piece of information and both claim that it supports
their idea.

I think that a big part of the reason for that is that often there is a
lot in common between the opposing philosophies (whether the adherents
are willing to acknowledge that or not; In my experience I would say
that in the Humanistic vs. Religionistic controversy, the humanists
are more likely to agree with that (though you probably couldn't
tell it from this forum!)).  My own personal viewpoint is that any
philosophical system, be it religionism, secular humanism, or being
a Jedi knight, have the same goals.  I feel that those goals are
what's important and not the method of getting there (before anyone
starts flaming, I am NOT saying the ends justify the means!) and
as a result of that religionism is just as valid a system as secular
humanism if it works for its adherents.  These goals can be achieved
within any system as long as that system works.

What these goals are is a tough question.  I wish you hadn't asked
that. :-)  I guess for me that these goals are two-fold (but both
interrelated); 1) giving a purpose/meaning to life, and 2) a set
of ethics and morals and justifications for them.  Comments and
additions on these points are extremely welcome!

Now I'm not religious (as if you couldn't tell from the above
paragraphs), but neither am I anti-religious.  My basic problem
stems from the fact that I perceive most religious people as
saying that only their way and their group is correct (you know
the old joke about being quiet outside the Catholics' room in
heaven because they think they're the only ones there.), and one
of the tenets of my philosophy that I stated above is that there
can and are multiple paths to the same goal (equally valid).
Though, to be honest I must admit that most faithful (as opposed
to religious) people that I've met (not many) are not as
self-righteous as I've made up above.  You know not the Jerry
Falwell types.  Hmmm, do you think that means that Jerry Falwell
is religious but not faithful?    .-j    (means half-way joking)

I realize that in the above letter I have been coming from the
humanistic point of view.  Rational replies of any viewpoint
are extremely welcome.  Irrational replies will sometimes be
read for their humorous value.
-- 

^-^ Bruce ^-^

University of Maryland, Computer Science
{rlgvax,seismo}!umcp-cs!israel (Usenet)    israel.umcp-cs@CSNet-Relay (Arpanet)

tim@unc.UUCP (11/08/83)

Not meaning to pick nits, but all this talk about religion and humanism
being opposed is a bit offensive to me, since I'm a devoutly religious
humanist.  I know that no offense was meant, so instead of getting upset I'm
just going to ask that you be more precise in your terminology.  Thanks.
________________________________________________________
Tim Maroney, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
duke!unc!tim (USENET), tim.unc@csnet-relay (ARPA)