[net.religion] Christ as good man

aeq@pucc-h (Jeff Sargent) (11/09/84)

From ucla-cs!ellen:

> Christ must have been a really good man and teacher, tho' i see him as being
> as much the son of god as any other person and animal and plant is the child
> of the creator....

I hate to disagree with a portion of an article which praised others for
showing some Christian love, but I feel I should point out a couple of things
(borrowed from "Mere Christianity"):

1. In some religions, it would indeed be nothing surprising for someone to say
   that he was the son of God, or one with God.  But in Judaism, things are
   not that way, and were not at the time of Jesus's ministry, and never have
   been; Judaism makes a strict differentiation between God and His creation
   (Yiri, correct me in case this is inaccurate).  When Jesus appeared among
   the Jews, applying phrases like "Son of God" and "Son of Man" (which I guess
   to be an allusion to chapter 7 of Daniel), He was calling Himself a lot more
   than any pantheistic "son of God".
2. If Jesus was not who and what He said He was, then He was either a world-
   class liar or else a world-class megalomaniac.  Funny, though, that demons
   thought He was what He said, and how people later staked their lives on
   their faith in Him.

-- 
-- Jeff Sargent
{decvax|harpo|ihnp4|inuxc|seismo|ucbvax}!pur-ee!pucc-h:aeq
"I'm not asking for anyone's bleeding charity."
"Then do.  At once.  Ask for the Bleeding Charity."

rlr@pyuxd.UUCP (Rich Rosen) (11/14/84)

>    If Jesus was not who and what He said He was, then He was either a world-
>    class liar or else a world-class megalomaniac.  Funny, though, that demons
>    thought He was what He said, and how people later staked their lives on
>    their faith in Him.  [JEFF SARGENT]

It's amazing how, when you want to believe a particular thing, you limit the
possibilities that you evaluate (perhaps so as not to "accidentally" come
across something that might force you to change your mind).  Other equally (and
perhaps more) viable possibilities:  1) Jesus never said any of those things,
but subsequent believers hoping to spread a good word about his life and work
made up (!!!) stories about him to promote the belief, stories you now accept
as gospel truth (pun intended!), 2) Jesus was manipulated by those around him,
just as "pop idols" in today's world may be manipulated by others.  Before you
discount these possibilities, please tell me precisely WHY you discount them.
(I can answer that:  because you PRESUME things about Jesus that would make
these possibilities impossible.  If I'm wrong, PLEASE let me know by providing
the real reason for discounting these possibilities.)

Tell me, Jeff, who proved to you about the existence of these "demons", about
how they thought what they thought about Jesus?  Such elucidation might prove
beneficial to all of us.  We'll either learn how one learns and accepts
religious belief, or we'll learn the level of verification and analysis one
goes through before accepting religious belief.
-- 
WHAT IS YOUR NAME?			Rich Rosen
WHAT IS YOUR NET ADDRESS?		pyuxd!rlr
WHAT IS THE CAPITAL OF ASSYRIA?		Nineveh    (GOTCHA!)
ALL RIGHT, OFF YOU GO...