[net.religion] Re 'Cheeses'/ Life of Brian

arndt@lymph.DEC (03/08/85)

I also saw the movie Life of Brian and here are a few comments about it.
(I am a great fan of Monty Python, by the way.)

Much of their religious 'humor' (not all!) is stupid silly and falls flat
on anyone with a small amount of knowledge of the religious beliefs involved.
Rather like a whine than wit.  I think really good religious humor has to be
about the beliefs REALLY held or understood.  Life of Brian, seen from this
perspective was hardly about the life of Christ at all.  Humor of all types
often takes what one believes about reality and pushes it to a silly conclusion
or fractures the 'map' of reality in such a way to create a tension that is
released in laughter.  But to parody what NO ONE believes misses the point
of humor.  That by way of general comment on Monty Python's religious humor as
I saw it in Life of Brian and The Meaning of Life as well.

I believe I saw death in Life of Brian!!!  By that I mean we were trundled
down the path leading to the conclusion that Christianity is silly and those
who believe it perhaps even sillier (although perhaps it could be said they
were making a parody of Christians who don't really understand their faith)
and then - with the mob on the crosses (Brian included) singing "Life is
Shitty" - they skillfully stick the knife in the audience!!!!!  Kill you as
you sit there laughing!  They HAVE no answer to the larger questions of life
to present (at least in the picture), only gallows (in this case literally)
humor!!!  It was chilling to behold!  Some people in the audience seemed to
get it as I observed them.  Many missed it.  It reminded me of the paintings
of the Pope in a glass box screaming a silent screem.  Forget the painter.

But there were some great one liners in both movies.  

Comments anyone??

Regards,

Ken Arndt

padraig@utastro.UUCP (Padraig Houlahan) (03/10/85)

> 
> I also saw the movie Life of Brian and here are a few comments about it.
> (I am a great fan of Monty Python, by the way.)
> 
> Much of their religious 'humor' (not all!) is stupid silly and falls flat
> on anyone with a small amount of knowledge of the religious beliefs involved.
> Rather like a whine than wit.  I think really good religious humor has to be
> about the beliefs REALLY held or understood.  Life of Brian, seen from this
> perspective was hardly about the life of Christ at all. Humor of all types
> often takes what one believes about reality and pushes it to a silly conclusion
> or fractures the 'map' of reality in such a way to create a tension that is
> released in laughter.  But to parody what NO ONE believes misses the point
> of humor.  That by way of general comment on Monty Python's religious humor as
> I saw it in Life of Brian and The Meaning of Life as well.
> 
> I believe I saw death in Life of Brian!!!  By that I mean we were trundled
> down the path leading to the conclusion that Christianity is silly and those
> who believe it perhaps even sillier (although perhaps it could be said they
> were making a parody of Christians who don't really understand their faith)
> and then - with the mob on the crosses (Brian included) singing "Life is
> Shitty" - they skillfully stick the knife in the audience!!!!!  Kill you as
> you sit there laughing!  They HAVE no answer to the larger questions of life
> to present (at least in the picture), only gallows (in this case literally)
> humor!!!  It was chilling to behold!  Some people in the audience seemed to
> get it as I observed them.  Many missed it.  It reminded me of the paintings
> of the Pope in a glass box screaming a silent screem.  Forget the painter.
> 
> But there were some great one liners in both movies.  
> 
> Comments anyone??
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Ken Arndt

I disagree. Traits that almost all religions share are the ability to
explain away previous obscurantic behaviour, and the tendency to reinterpret
and change their positions on issues when their obscurantism becomes
evident. This was well illustrated at the scene concerning the
sermon on the mount when someone in the audience asked "what did he say?",
and was told that Brian had said "Blessed are the cheesemakers".
But fortunately there was someone around to interpret this gem of wisdom
correctly. The "real" interpretation was "Blessed are those engaged in the
dairy industry..." 

Examples of issues that western religions have reversed themselves on, or are 
currently reconsidering their proclaimed viewpoint are: witchcraft, 
homosexuality, purgatory, the role of women in the church, scripture,
nuclear weapons and so-called "Just-wars", contraception etc. to name
but a few. This is not to say that all religions are doing each of
these, but the point is that these will be justified in the name
of growth, or maturity, or evolution in religious thought; 
adhered to with the same vigor as the previously held beliefs,
and proclaimed as the true and final interpretation - until revised
for convenience later.

This point was excellently made in the above mentioned scene.

jcp@osiris.UUCP (Jody Patilla) (03/11/85)

> > 
> > I also saw the movie Life of Brian and here are a few comments about it.
> > (I am a great fan of Monty Python, by the way.)
> > .........
> > were making a parody of Christians who don't really understand their faith)
> > and then - with the mob on the crosses (Brian included) singing "Life is
> > Shitty" - they skillfully stick the knife in the audience!!!!!  
> > 
> > Ken Arndt
> 

	The song at the end of "Life of Brian" is "Always Look at the
Bright Side of Life". It has a catchy tune, and no scatological
references that I can recall.
-- 
  

jcpatilla

"'Get stuffed !', the Harlequin replied ..."

rlr@pyuxd.UUCP (Professor Wagstaff) (03/11/85)

> I also saw the movie Life of Brian and here are a few comments about it.
> Much of their religious 'humor' (not all!) is stupid silly and falls flat
> on anyone with a small amount of knowledge of the religious beliefs involved.

TRANSLATION:  I just couldn't take it.  It showed all sorts of emptyheaded
flaws in my thinking, and thus it must have been stupid.

> They HAVE no answer to the larger questions of life
> to present (at least in the picture), only gallows (in this case literally)
> humor!!!  It was chilling to behold!

Actually, they ASK the larger questions of life of those who don't want to hear
the question.

> (I am a great fan of Monty Python, by the way.)

I can only assume that Arndt said this just to annoy us.  (i.e., "Oh, my god,
Arndy likes Python!  I'd better change my tastes immediately...")
-- 
Life is complex.  It has real and imaginary parts.
					Rich Rosen  ihnp4!pyuxd!rlr

larryg@teklds.UUCP (Larry Gardner) (03/12/85)

I wanted to reply to something that was said regarding changing views
on subjects, such as war, women, contraception, and the "biggies", 
homosexuality, witchcraft, sexuality.

If we change our religion to fit today, or what we want to do, then
we have pure "religion".  In other words, man making his own way to
God, deciding the way, the truth, and the means.  That makes me ill.
My thinking and life must line up with God's, not His with mine.

karen

john@x.UUCP (John Woods) (03/13/85)

> > > and then - with the mob on the crosses (Brian included) singing "Life is
> > > Shitty" - they skillfully stick the knife in the audience!!!!!  
> > > Ken Arndt
> 	The song at the end of "Life of Brian" is "Always Look at the
> Bright Side of Life". It has a catchy tune, and no scatological
> references that I can recall.
> jcpatilla
		  vv
From "Always Look ON The Bright Side of Life":	@KeyChange(G)
	``Life's a piece of shit
		When you look at it...''

This is the only scatalogical reference, however.  The song does parody those
people who insist on being happy and cheery when circumstances dictate other-
wise, and worse, insist that others share their sentiments.

As a friend of mine once said,  "Had Norman Vincent Peale been aboard the
Titanic, he would have whipped the people into a frenzy of positive thinking
that would have saved the doomed ocean liner...or would he?"

-- 
John Woods, Charles River Data Systems, Framingham MA, (617) 626-1101
...!decvax!frog!john, ...!mit-eddie!jfw, jfw%mit-ccc@MIT-XX.ARPA

When you're chewing on life's gristle,
	Just give a little whistle!

iannucci@sjuvax.UUCP (iannucci) (03/14/85)

In article <174@osiris.UUCP> jcp@osiris.UUCP (Jody Patilla) writes:
>
>	The song at the end of "Life of Brian" is "Always Look at the
>Bright Side of Life". It has a catchy tune, and no scatological
>references that I can recall.
>-- 
>jcpatilla


            Actually, while the song was basically positive in its
outlook, there was this one line: 

      "Life's a piece of sh*t, when you look at it"

    after which the lyrics became a bit more cynical than at first. This
no doubt accounts for the misinterpretation.
-- 
Dave Iannucci
St. Joseph's University, Philadelphia
...{allegra|astrovax|bpa|burdvax}!sjuvax!iannucci
"A witty saying proves nothing. "      --Voltaire

brower@fortune.UUCP (Richard Brower) (03/15/85)

In article <444@teklds.UUCP> larryg@teklds.UUCP (Larry Gardner) writes:
>I wanted to reply to something that was said regarding changing views
>on subjects, such as war, women, contraception, and the "biggies", 
>homosexuality, witchcraft, sexuality.
>
>karen

Do you mean to say here that homosexuality, whichcraft, and sexuality
are worse than than WAR?  I don't understand the references to women and
contraception at all, except that they seem to be as bad as war, but not
as bad as being a faggot.  Do you mean that being a woman is as evil as
starting a war?  Do you mean that using contraception is as bad as starting
a war?

Looking forward to your reply
-- 
Richard A. Brower		Fortune Systems
{ihnp4,ucbvax!amd,hpda,sri-unix,harpo}!fortune!brower

mangoe@umcp-cs.UUCP (Charley Wingate) (03/15/85)

In article <642@pyuxd.UUCP> rlr@pyuxd.UUCP (Professor Wagstaff) writes:

>> I also saw the movie Life of Brian and here are a few comments about it.
>> Much of their religious 'humor' (not all!) is stupid silly and falls flat
>> on anyone with a small amount of knowledge of the religious beliefs
>> involved.

>TRANSLATION:  I just couldn't take it.  It showed all sorts of emptyheaded
>flaws in my thinking, and thus it must have been stupid.

Oh, come off it, Rich.  That supposed translation is just what you would
like your intended victim to be saying.  I, too, same _Brian_, and while I
was mildly amused, I found it lacking on two counts:

(1) I don't particularly like the M.P. style of humor; and

(2) I've heard most of their jibes so many times before that I find them
    boring.

Rich, you seem to think that the arguments you bring against christianity
are new.  They're not.  Most of the things you've brought up were argued
against by Aquinas, and there are lots of responses to them through the
years.  I don't suppose you've bothered reading any of them, though.


Charley Wingate   umcp-cs!mangoe