pez@pyuxn.UUCP (Paul Zimmerman) (08/16/85)
Beth Chirsty, in reply to my earlier article, which I just accidentally reposted (sorry), said that if that article wasn't satire, ``then something evil sure hurt this boy.'' She is most certainly right. That something was and is God. The same evil monster who infests all our lives with pain and frustration. A few other people have sent mail to me complimenting me on my ``parody'' article. I don't want to disappoint any of you, but that article was most definitely no parody at all. There exists a God, a hideous evil damager monster, who uses His entropic force to shatter everything from individual human lives to the universe at large. A perfect example: in the last article I mentioned the maxim about how much easier it is to destroy than to create. This by itself is proof of the existence of an unbalanced force, called entropy by scientists, which is really the hateful will of the Damager-God. Another well worn maxim is Murphy's Law. Among the famous corollaries to this is ``if you bring your umbrella, it won't rain.'' Of course, the converse is that if you forget your umbrella, it's almost sure to rain, given the right conditions of course. Ever wonder why this is also a truism? Clearly it is because the Damager-God is thwarted from His pleasurable act of causing you harm if you have brought along protection from that harm. Naturally, another of Murphy's (God's) corollaries takes effect in these circumstances: if it's not one thing, it's another. God can always find a way to cause misery, no matter how prepared you try to be, and He always will. Christians nowadays make a very big deal about prophesies of the end of the world found in the Bible, claiming that ours is the generation in which the prophesies come true. Have any of them ever stopped to think about why those prophesies are so accurate? About what the source of information was? Who else, but the Damager-God, could provide such prophetic information? Of course the prophesies are accurate, He's only telling you in advance what He plans to do! All the horrible catastrophes He will beseige the Earth with at the ``Judgment Day.'' Have any of these Christians thought about the role of Christianity in these prophesies? To me it is quite clear. The prophesies speak of the Devil (really God himself) having reign of the Earth during the millenia after the death of Christ. Look at what religion has been the dominant force in the world, through conquest, crusade, and colonialism since that time. Yes, you've got it, Christianity! Christ was the Antichrist! Just as surely as God is Satan. If you doubt that God is really Satan and vice versa, think about this. Think about how terribly convenient it is to be able to point a finger and say ``he did it'' when you do something bad. Since God does so many bad things so often, including natural disasters, diseases, fomenting hatred and war, etc. all the while claiming to be the ultimate good, being able to say ``Satan did it'' must come in real handy. The Damager-God is a listless shirker of responsibility. Notice how He didn't come down to Earth himself. No, He sent his son to mislead the people and then suffer the pains of crucifixion. This surely sounds more like the handiwork of some sleazy movie Mafioso (sending His son to do the dirty work) and not the awesome majestic benevolent God so often imagined. I am truly shocked that so many people thought my article was some sort of satire. The preponderence of evidence makes it painfully obvious that God does exist, and that He is one evil motherf*cker. He has built into us a wish to see Him as a great and loving father, even though He clearly is nothing of the sort. He uses this against us at every opportunity. I must say that the near unanimity of opinion that my article was intended to be satirical frightens me a great deal. It means God has a stranglehold on us all, believers or not. Even those among the atheists and agnostics who responded to me thought the idea of a Damager-God was an amusing satirical ploy at best. It's as if they were completely blinded by the way this explanation of the universe answers many questions previously unanswered by either the benevolent god explanation or the no god explanation. The explanation fits, it makes sense, it explains the nature of things better than any other. This thing science calls entropy manifests itself in ways that can only be explained as deliberate, thoughtful, malevolent action of a conscious deity. There is no evidence for a directly opposite benevolent creative force to counteract entropy's destructiveness. People talk about ``nature taking its course'', but certainly it is unable to do this. God, the willful force of entropy and destruction and evil, permeates nature and corrupts it beyond recognition. Some months ago, Dan Boscovich spoke of objective proof for his beliefs. His ``proofs'' were a sham, and everyone from Hubeynz and Rosen to Ellis and Wingate knew it. Yet he continues to believe along with many others. Compare his ``objective proof'' to mine. My explanation answers questions about the real world. Boscovich's explanation, apparently borrowed from other Christian apologists, simply forces his ``good God'' explanation in any way it can, even where it doesn't make sense. A famous Christian book currently available is called ``Why Bad Things Happen to Good People''. I assume Christians have some contorted explanation for this. Surely the simpler and far more fathomable explanation is that a bad God does bad things to good people, because He likes it. Ever wonder why good things always happen to bad people? Maybe because they act as agents of God. By being bad, they provide God with more opportunities to infect the world with His evil wanton destruction and pain. Thus they are rewarded. Rich Rosen is right when he calls you all wishful thinkers. The evidence is clear. It's staring you right in the face. But you choose to think of the world as being run by a ``good'' God rather than a ``bad'' one, because it makes you more comfortable and less frightened. Yet Rosen and his fellow atheists and materialists don't see the writing on the wall either. When faced with willful destructiveness eating away at the world, the scientific types throw up their hands and say ``that's entropy'' or something like that. Surely willful evil cannot be disposed of by simply saying it's a natural force of some sort. Such evil can only be attributed to an evil heinous Damager-God. The one that millions of people worship and pray to daily as the almighty force of good, taken in by his manipulation and deception. -- Paul Zimmerman - AT&T Bell Laboratories pyuxn!pez
jho@ihu1m.UUCP (Yosi Hoshen) (08/17/85)
> A perfect example: in the last article I mentioned the maxim about > how much easier it is to destroy than to create. This by itself is proof of > the existence of an unbalanced force, called entropy by scientists, which > is really the hateful will of the Damager-God. If you notice from my postings, I am not on God's buddy list. But this time, I have to come to his defense. There is nothing evil in the concept of entropy. It means that since there are many more random states relative to what we perceive as ordered states, it is more likely that the transitions will be to random states. Implying that in a closed system the tendency is towards disorder. So, there is nothing evil about entropy, but there is a lot of misunder- standing. -- Yosi Hoshen, AT&T Bell Laboratories Naperville, Illinois, Mail: ihnp4!ihu1m!jho
jmc@riccb.UUCP (Jeff McQuinn ) (08/19/85)
Man, I don't even believe in God and I think your sick! Jeff McQuinn just VAXing around
pez@pyuxn.UUCP (Paul Zimmerman) (08/19/85)
No, Yosi, there is nothing inherently evil about entropy. But an examination of how it is used by the Damager-God makes it clear what his intentions are. You say ``there are many more random states than ordered states,'' making it more likely that transitions will be into random states. Well, who is responsible for that if not God Himself? Why is the tendency for a closed system to lean towards disorder? Doesn't that sound peculiar to you? Maybe it is doing that because the system is not closed at all, because a Damager-God sticks His hand into it and wreaks havoc. -- Paul Zimmerman - AT&T Bell Laboratories pyuxn!pez
pez@pyuxn.UUCP (Paul Zimmerman) (08/20/85)
Jeff McQuinn wrote a one-line article about my writing in which he said ``Man, I don't even believe in God and I think your [sic] sick!'' Well, Jeff, unfortunately you've made the assumption that because there isn't a good God as described in the Bible, there must none at all. This is not so. The possibility of an evil God is not only present, it is much more likely than no God or good God scenarios, as supported by the evidence of the world around you. You assume that anyone who believes in the existence of an evil God must be ``sick.'' On the other hand, I think that anyone who denies the possibility or the likelihood of the existence of an evil God is at best working from a faulty assumption, or at worst deceptively misled. -- Paul Zimmerman - AT&T Bell Laboratories pyuxn!pez
chrisand@fluke.UUCP (J. Chris Anderson) (08/21/85)
> -- > Paul Zimmerman - AT&T Bell Laboratories > pyuxn!pez In response to Mr. Zimmerman's article, I can very much identify with those people who thought his article was satirical, simply because I had never encountered anyone as extreme in his viewpoint as he. Since it would be absolutely ridiculous to try and argue with Mr. Zimmerman, I would like to keep this short and point out a few things. Assuming that Mr. Zimmerman is correct, and that there exists a Damager-God who is out to destroy the world, that leaves me with a few choices: 1. I can choose to believe as Mr. Z. does and will live my days battling it out against this god in constant anxiety and fear that this god will strike at anytime. I would see clearly that all the tragedies ocurring in my life and around me as the Damger-God out to get me. Then, when I died, I suppose I would either cease to exist or live in a "hell" with this Damager-God. 2. I can choose to believe in a lie, that the God of the universe is really a benevolent and loving god, who is blessing me and leading me in this life to a life beyond in heaven with him. I would then interpret all the tragedies ocurring in my life and around me as natural occurences or else that my (false) god was calling me to growth and a deepening in my reliance on Him. After I died I would then be in the same condition as in #1. 3. (I can live indifferently.) Looking objectively at these two viewpoints on life, I can see that no matter what I believed on earth, I would end up the same after death; therefore my beliefs would only affect my life on earth. Weighing the two viewpoints, I would the one with which I could be happier. I would then choose #2, because this viewpoint would lead me to a life of joy, hope, and love instead of fear and anxiety. I can not see a way of continuing on and being happy knowing that there was a Damager-God bringing destruction to my life. One last thing I have noticed in Mr. Zimmerman's articles. If there is any truth to projection (extending one's own inner personality to another), I would say that Mr. Z. is not a very happy person. Mr Z, my prayers are for you; I'll ask the Damager-God not to zap you today.
sdyer@bbncc5.UUCP (Steve Dyer) (08/21/85)
Though entertaining, this discussion is very marginally related
to net.origins, and should be exiled to net.religion at once
before the Damager-God comes in the form of the Men-with-the-
Butterfly-Nets and carts us all away!
--
/Steve Dyer
{harvard,seismo}!bbnccv!bbncc5!sdyer
sdyer@bbncc5.ARPAvmc@mhuxj.UUCP (Verbus M. Counts) (08/26/85)
From the writings of the Bab. "Say: God is indeed the Maker of all things. He giveth sustenance in plenty to whomsoever He willeth. He is the Creator, the Source of all beings, the Fashioner, the All-Mighty, the Maker, the All-Wise. He is the Bearer of the most excellent titles throughout the heavens and the earth and whatever lieth between them. All do His bidding, and all the dwellers of earth and heaven celebrate His praise, and unto Him shall all return." (Selections from the writings of the Bab, p211) Regards, Verbus M. Counts AT&T Bell Labs The Word of God(religion) is one, (201) 564-2510 101 JFK Parkway though the speakers are many ... ihnp4!mhuxj!vmc Room 1L-423 August 25,1985 Short Hills, NJ 07078 The Baha'i Faith
vmc@mhuxj.UUCP (Verbus M. Counts) (08/26/85)
The following is from the writings of Baha'u'llah (The Glory of God)
about God.
Lauded be Thy name, O lord my God! How great is Thy might and
Thy sovereignty; how vast Thy strength and Thy dominion!
All praise, O my God, be to The Who art the Source of all glory
and majesty, of greatness and honor, of sovereignty and dominion,
of loftiness and grace, of awe and power.
Exalted, immeasurably exalted, art Thou above the strivings of
mortal man to unravel Thy mystery, to describe Thy glory, or even
to hint at the nature of Thine Essence. For whatever such
strivings may accomplish, they never can hope to transcend the
limitations imposed upon Thy creatures, inasmuch as these efforts
are actuated by Thy decree, and are begotten of Thine invention.
The loftiest sentiments which the holiest of saints can express
in praise of Thee, and the deepest wisdom which the most learned
of men can utter in their attempts to comprehend Thy nature, all
revolve around that Center Which is wholly subjected to Thy
sovereignty, Which adoreth Thy Beauty, and is propelled through
the movement of Thy Pen.
God testifieth to the unity of His Godhood and to the singleness
of His own Being. On The throne of eternity, from the
inaccessible heights of His station, His tongue proclaimeth that
there is none other God but Him. He Himself, independently of
all else, hath ever been a witness unto His own oneness, the
revealer of His own nature, the glorifier of His own essence.
He, verily, is the ALL-Powerful, the Almighty, the Beauteous.
He is supreme over His servants, and standeth over His creatures.
In His hand is the source of authority and truth. He maketh men
alive by His signs, and causeth them to die through His wrath.
He shall not be asked of His doing and His might is equal unto
all things. He is the Potent, the All-Subduing. He holdeth
within His grasp the empire of all things, and on His right hand
is fixed the Kingdom of His Revelation. His power, verily,
embraceth the whole of creation. Victory and overlordship are
His; all might and dominion are His; all glory and greatness are
His. He, of a truth, is the All-Glorious, the Most Powerful, the
Unconditioned.
Know thou of a certainty that the Unseen can in no wise incarnate
His Essence and reveal it unto men. He is, and hath ever been,
immensely exalted beyond all that can either be recounted or
perceived. From His retreat of glory His voice is ever
proclaiming: "Verily, I am God; there is none other God besides
Me, the All-Knowing, the All-Wise. I have manifested Myself unto
men, and have sent down Him Who is the Dayspring of the signs of
My Revelation. Through Him I have caused all creation to testify
that there is none other God except Him, the Incomparable, the
All-Informed, the All-Wise." He who is everlastingly hidden from
the eyes of men can never be known except through His
Manifestation, and His Manifestation can adduce no greater proof
of the truth of His Mission than the proof of His own Person.
Exalted, immeasurably exalted art Thou above any attempt to
measure the greatness of Thy Cause, above any comparison that one
may seek to make, above the efforts of the human tongue to utter
its import! From everlasting Thou hast existed, alone with no
one else beside Thee, and wilt, to everlasting, continue to
remain the same, in the sublimity of Thine essence and the
inaccessible heights of Thy glory.
And when Thou didst purpose to make Thyself known unto men, Thou
didst successively reveal the Manifestations of Thy Cause, and
ordained each to be a sign of Thy Revelation among Thy people,
and the Dayspring of Thine invisible Self amidst Thy
creatures.....
Baha'u'llah
Regards,
Verbus M. Counts AT&T Bell Labs The Word of God(religion) is one,
(201) 564-2510 101 JFK Parkway though the speakers are many ...
ihnp4!mhuxj!vmc Room 1L-423
August 25,1985 Short Hills, NJ 07078 The Baha'i Faithpez@pyuxn.UUCP (Paul Zimmerman) (08/26/85)
I'm not sure why J. Chris Anderson claims that it would be ``absolutely ridiculous'' to argue with me. My position is solidly based in factual evidence, unlike that of those who whorship the Damager-God. They are engaging in what Rosen calls ``wishful thinking.'' (Though Rosen engages in it himself with his atheism, but that's another story.) I did not say that the Damager-God was ``out to destroy the world.'' What I did say was that He is using the world (and us) for His perverse and evil pleasure, and will persist in doing this until He chooses to make Armageddon dust of us all in a fit of ultimate pleasure. After that I assume He will again tamper with the natural flow of things to mold the world to His sick desire to damage. The choices you offer are somewhat ironic, because they summarize the three grand world views held by human beings. [1] Realize the evidence pointing to the existence of the Damager-God, and accept the fact that He exists, either bemoaning a sad and painful fate or working to grapple for whatever happiness we can get in a world with a filthy pig in charge. [2] Choosing ``to believe in a lie, that the God of the universe is a benevolent and loving God.'' As Mr. Anderson said, all tragedies would be interpreted as natural occurences and all good things would be interpreted as actions by God. Unfortunately, this is the reverse of what actually happens, and a perfect example of how God has f*cked up our minds to His advantage. [3] Living indifferently. I take this to mean not caring or not having an opinion about God (agnosticism) or denying His existence (atheism). Perhaps I flatter myself by calling maltheism one of the ``three grand world views,'' but I don't think I'm alone in this view. I also think the number of people holding this view is growing. Mr. Anderson says that despite the evidence against it, he would choose view [2], because it would make him feel better in this life, regardless of how accurate that view is. I'm afraid that doesn't sound like a very good reason to me. It smacks of Rosen's buzzword ``wishful thinking,'' since he chooses it just because it makes him ``happier.'' I could see not caring (for as long as you could), but not just offhandedly blocking out the truth because you don't like it. Mr. Anderson says that I must not be a very happy person for holding my views of God and the world. I beg to disagree. I find I have never been quite so happy as I have been since recognizing God for what He is. I could not find love and joy in a hypocritical stance where I simply deny the evil of God to make me feel better about life. But I do find joy in beating God out of chances to cause me harm. There is no way to be universally happy with the Damager-God interfering in all our lives, except through denying His existence. And I could not find happiness in lying to myself. But please, Mr. Anderson, do not waste your prayers to the monster pig Damager-God. Not on me, and not on yourself. I hope you realize that He laughs at you as you pray, and uses your confiding in Him against you. -- Paul Zimmerman - AT&T Bell Laboratories pyuxn!pez
tynor@gitpyr.UUCP (Steve Tynor) (08/27/85)
In article <309@mhuxj.UUCP> vmc@mhuxj.UUCP (Verbus M. Counts) writes: >The following is from the writings of Baha'u'llah (The Glory of God) >about God. > >Lauded be Thy name, O lord my God! How great is Thy might and >Thy sovereignty; how vast Thy strength and Thy dominion! Etc, etc, etc... KEEP IT OUT OF net.origins !!!!!!!! =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Eschew Obfuscation. Steve Tynor Georgia Instutute of Technology ...{akgua, allegra, amd, harpo, hplabs, ihnp4, masscomp, ut-ngp, rlgvax, sb1, uf-cgrl, unmvax, ut-sally} !gatech!gitpyr!tynor -- Steve Tynor Georgia Insitute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 ...!{akgua,allegra,amd,hplabs,ihnp4,masscomp,ut-ngp}!gatech!gitpyr!tynor