[net.philosophy] and this one is from ME

laura@utcsstat.UUCP (Laura Creighton) (09/05/83)

I think that in the free will vs determinism debate we have several
questions all lumped together. I am going to try to unpack some of them.

1: What is consciousness?

2: Given that consciousness exists, is it a function of the physical
   structure of the mind?

3: Does the existance of consciousness imply the existance of free will?

4: Does the non-existance of concsiousness imply the non-existsnce of free will?

Inherant in all these discussions, and thus fundamental to them is the notion
of causality. Most predictive theories (both scientific and philosophical)
have an implicit belief that there is a cause to every action. 

	NOTE THIS DOES NOT MEAN THAT THERE IS A GOD TO CAUSE THE UNIVERSE.
	NOBODY GETS TO MISQUOTE ME THAT WAY.

On the other hand, it does not rule out the existance of God, either,
i am just not interested in God in this whole argument, okay. What
I am saying is that it that you can look at an event and then say that
something (or somethings) caused it. Thus you can further knowledge by
discovering the causes of things.

Paul Torek's broken window is an effect and we can see that the cause
of it it Paul deciding to hurl some object at it.

The problem arises when we decide to see what 'caused' Paul to hurl the
object at the window at the first place. We might ask him. he might
reply, "Because I wanted to". Now if you were a psychiatrist, or a
policement come to cart Paul off for damaging property, you might not find
this a satisfactory answer, because you might want to know WHY Paul
decided to do this. Suppose he answered "to demonstrate a point for
the readers of net.philosophy". he might have to answer other questions,
but at some pointt the questions would stop. Paul broke the window
because he wanted to, and now we have some better understanding of why
he would want to do this.

Note -- all these people believe that Paul has free will, because
"i wanted to" has some meaning for them. They may not believe that he
is entirely free, however, but there is some measure of freedom which
he is believed to have. Most people believe that he could have not
broken the window had he chosen not to.

There is another class of person that believes that Paul had no choice.
When the window, the object, and Paul came together it was necessary
for the window to be broken -- it was the only possible course of events,
because everything is determined. These same people would contend that
i have no choice but to write this article and you have no choice but
to read it now, and those of you who are about to hit <BREAK> have
no choice in that either. In general these people also believe that
if you could adequately model what is going on in soemeone's head
then you could also predict with 100% accuracy what is going to happen.
There are no secrets, just delicate chemical balances which can be
predicted and thus a model of exactly what is going to happen could
be made. In general, these people think that they could change what
was going to happen by changing the chemistry of the brain -- except
that since they are also determined by their own brain chemistries and
the nature of the world "what was going to happen" never was going to
happen at all. This does not mean that there cannot be improvement.

Now, how does the Quantum Mechanics fit into this?
it says that at one level causality is meaningless. things do not
happen because they are caused by other things, things just happen.


Now, the question is, does this make any difference? Science did not
stop having predictive value just because of Quantum Mechanics!

Well, at this point, one has to stop until one figures out what consciousness
is. If consciousness is a macro-level phenomenon, then Quantum mechanics should
not have any effect. if, however, it is not then we are going to have to
abandon pure determinism -- because at a certain level people 'are conscious
of things' for no reason.

No matter what happens in the long run, however, the strict determinists
have a real problem already. Current studies of the brain show that brain
Chemistry is very important. And chemistry is measured in probabilities.
And noone can build a perfectly deterministic model of how chemical
reactions take place -- one can only talk about the 'average reaction'
and 'chemical equilibrium' which is not quite good enough for the strict  
determinists. if you want to predict the behavior of something, saying that
'there is a 20% that this nerve will fire' +/- X% is not really good
enough. If I feed you LSD I may be able to predict that you will
hallucinate, but I cannot really predict exactly what your hallucinations
are.

laura creighton
utzoo!utcsstat!laura