spaf@gatech.UUCP (Gene Spafford) (04/06/84)
I guess the existence of the mailing list explains the lack of articles
in net.women.only in recent weeks. I seem to remember during the
discussion of the mailing list that a few of the more vocal proponents
felt it would be counter-productive if traffic on the public newsgroups
was to disappear as a result of the formation of the mailing list.
Maybe this is really a subtle plot to do away with the open discussion
of women's issues on the net?
I've had a number of things to say in this newsgroup over the last year
or two, and I thought most of it was considered and reasonable. I
guess not, because all I've ever heard about the mailing list is from
news articles by people claiming to be on the list and that's all. I
must conclude that my opinions and participation in this area are
unwelcome, else at least one person (female or otherwise) would have
told me about the list, and maybe even extended an invitation.
Not that I'd really be interested in contributing to such a mailing
list. I mean, there are thousands of network readers who might benefit
from and appreciate the items that could be discussed, yet they aren't
on the mailing list (paranoia sets in -- they are on the list, every
one of them. I'm not.). They are denied the potential due to the
irresponsible actions of some people in the past which led to the
formation of the list. Somehow, that just doesn't seem right. I
wouldn't contribute to the list because I will not support
segregationist activities. Everything I've seen posted about the
mailing list has been irritating, but maybe that's just me.
(sarcasm mode on)
Mailing lists evolved into the news a few years ago. This mailing list
is an interesting devolution. Maybe it is intended to be an
interesting social experiment? Let me add to it -- how about the rest
of us create a new newsgroup named
net.not-good-enough-for-the-mailing-list or a
net.our-opinions-and-interests-don't-matter (a different mailing list
would seem more appropriate but somehow contradictory)? Then we could
complain when someone who *is* on the mailing list submits something to
"our" newsgroup. We can take it though, it's only words and right is on
our side.
(sarcasm mode off)
I'll probably have people flame me about this, claiming that I am not
sensitive to feminist issues. That will undoubtedly be from
individuals who don't know me and who keep me at a distance from their
discussions. Feminist issues are *people* issues and they have effects
on us all. Separate is not equal. If it is any consolation, I've
already been labeled as a misogynist jerk or an unimportant cretin (I'm
not sure which -- maybe both) by implication -- I'm not on the mailing
list. Feel free to add to that description if it helps increase your
______ (insert word that is a female counterpart for macho) image.
Abusive letters will be cheerfully ignored. Serious discussion welcomed,
especially from other second-class network contributors.
--
Off the Wall of Gene Spafford
The Clouds Project, School of ICS, Georgia Tech, Atlanta GA 30332
CSNet: Spaf @ GATech ARPA: Spaf.GATech @ CSNet-Relay
uucp: ...!{akgua,allegra,rlgvax,sb1,unmvax,ulysses,ut-sally}!gatech!spafjj@rabbit.UUCP (04/06/84)
Well, Gene, I agree with you on this one, although not because of the issue of secrecy. From what I've seen in net.women and in net.women.only, there will always be someone willing and ready to ridicule anyone who wishes to raise a sensitive and touchy issue. I agree with you because of some of the mail I've gotten from people supposedly on the mailing list, i.e. several of the responses to my article requesting a minimum of courtesy have been of the sort, "Your article makes it clear why we're on a mailing list, and why you're NOT on it." Frankly, I don't understand that at all, and I have a strong feeling that I'm not supposed to understand it, either. I've also received a lot of mail about that article in a positive vein, mostly from folks who commonly contribute to net.women (.only). I've also gotten some mail from people whose consciences I must have poked, muttering about how courtesy doesn't work, etc. (These last respondants, with one notable exception, were uniformly male.) Frankly, I am disappointed that such a mailing list is (or appears to be) used as an excuse for petty emotional bickering, as well as for its more important use of discussing women's issues in a forum that can be partly regulated. I'm NOT going to post any of the names of people on the mailing list who sent me the mal that I object to, regardless of the insult intended, as such an action would only lead to more emotional bickering (as well as harrasment) involving those individuals. I guess this shows that members of both "sides" of the human race can be petty and shortsighted. I'm not surprised, unfortunately. (For the record, the word 'sides' is in quotes, as I don't appreciate it's use when referring to sex vs. sex. We're all in this together, and we damn well better learn to deal with it.) From the stuffed animal shelf of the outsider: -- TEDDY BEARS ARE NICER THAN PEOPLE--HUG YOURS TODAY! (If you go out in the woods today ... ) (allegra,harpo,ulysses)!rabbit!jj