js2j@mhuxt.UUCP (sonntag) (01/10/85)
I've been following the discussion here about the use of 'they' instead
of 'he' as a third person singular indefinate sex pronoun, and as I was
writing an article recently, I needed just such a pronoun. I thought:
"What the heck, let's try out this 'they' word."; and did. The results
were less than satisfying. This is the phrase I ended up with:
"<someone's userid> is anonymous; if they finds out where I live, will
they come bomb my house?"
Now it may be that I've used this word inappropriately somehow, (though
it seems to be right to me) but if not, then I guess I'll have to agree with
the people who said that it looks and sounds very clumsy.
--
Jeff Sonntag
ihnp4!mhuxt!js2j
"Things always seem darkest just before they get totally black."marla@ssc-vax.UUCP (Peckham) (01/11/85)
Jeff Sonntag asks about the use of the pronoun they: > "<someone's userid> is anonymous; if they finds out where I live, will > they come bomb my house?" > > Now it may be that I've used this word inappropriately somehow, (though > it seems to be right to me) but if not, then I guess I'll have to agree with > the people who said that it looks and sounds very clumsy. I feel the pronoun "they" should be used in the same manner as the pronoun "you". Noone makes the distinction between the singular you and the plural (except in the South, with y'all). Jeff, you wouldn't say "if you FINDS out...", you say "if you FIND out..". If you use the pronoun they as both singular and plural, in the same way we currently use the pronoun you, people will get used to it, and will not have any problem dealing with it. All it will take is some time for the "differentness" of useing they to wear off. Marla Baer-Peckham sac-vax!marla [Place a standard disclaimer here]
gam@amdahl.UUCP (gam) (01/13/85)
> > I've been following the discussion here about the use of 'they' instead > of 'he' as a third person singular indefinate sex pronoun, and as I was > writing an article recently, I needed just such a pronoun. I thought: > "What the heck, let's try out this 'they' word."; and did. The results > were less than satisfying. This is the phrase I ended up with: > "<someone's userid> is anonymous; if they finds out where I live, will > they come bomb my house?" This has a more serious error: you want it to be subjunctive. "<someone's userid> is anonymous; if they were to find out where I live, would they bomb my house?" Not so bad, is it? -- Gordon A. Moffett ...!{ihnp4,hplabs,sun}!amdahl!gam
ed@mtxinu.UUCP (Ed Gould) (01/13/85)
> The results > were less than satisfying. This is the phrase I ended up with: > "<someone's userid> is anonymous; if they finds out where I live, will > they come bomb my house?" In colloquial use, I would phrase this "incorrectly" as "... if they find out ...", mixing singular and plural. In many cases, the referant of the pronoun *isn't* specifically singular, in which case even the "they" is plural. In written work, I typically avoid the singular/plural problem by writing in plural whenever possible - which turns out to be most of the time. This leads me to another point of question, on which I'm not sure I like the answer I seem to find. If the referent of the pronoun is a known person (i.e., their gender is known) what is the correct form? Some would argue that either "he" or "she" should be used as appropriate. I'm not so sure, since the whole point of the "their" discussion is to avoid discrimination (or, really, to avoid the furtherance of a discriminatory system since in the best of all possible worlds it might be reasonable to define one pronoun [e.g., "she"] to mean both genders). If I were to use "he" referring to a man, who is otherwise unidentified - that is the context does not specify that there is a particular individual - then there is confusion as to whether the "he" is male or neuter. What do you all think about this one? (By the way, was the use of "their" above ["... their gender is known ..."] uncomfortable to people who prefer "he"? That context seems particularly innoucous to me. Maybe I'm just used to it [which is what I want].) -- Ed Gould mt Xinu, 739 Allston Way, Berkeley, CA 94710 USA {ucbvax,decvax}!mtxinu!ed +1 415 644 0146
chabot@amber.DEC (l s chabot) (01/14/85)
Jeff Sonntag == > > I've been following the discussion here about the use of 'they' instead of > 'he' as a third person singular indefinate sex pronoun, and as I was writing > an article recently, I needed just such a pronoun. I thought: "What the heck, > let's try out this 'they' word."; and did. The results were less than > satisfying. This is the phrase I ended up with: > "<someone's userid> is anonymous; if they finds out where I live, will > they come bomb my house?" > Now it may be that I've used this word inappropriately somehow, (though it > seems to be right to me) but if not, then I guess I'll have to agree with the > people who said that it looks and sounds very clumsy. It *does* often sound clumsy to have number conflict between the subject and the verb ("...if they finds out"). It is suggested that you rephrase your sentence to be "<someone's userid> is anonymous; if they find out where I live, will they come bomb my house?" Now evaluate it for clumsiness. And in answer to the question, I think they'll do that only if their userid is "anarchist" rather than "anonymous". :-) L S Chabot UUCP: ...decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-amber!chabot ARPA: ...chabot%amber.DEC@decwrl.ARPA