barryg@sdcrdcf.UUCP (Lee Gold) (10/11/85)
I'm not sure I totally believe all this but...according to Thorstein Veblen's THEORY OF THE
bing@galbp.UUCP (Bing Bang) (10/18/85)
i would look terrible wearing a skirt-- i have my knees turned inwards (what do you call that?) come to think of it, i don't look all that hot in my slacks! *sigh*************** -- ---------- "Break but never bend" ...akgua!galbp!bing
jeff@rtech.UUCP (Jeff Lichtman) (10/20/85)
> I'm not sure I totally believe all this but...according to Thorstein > Veblen's THEORY OF THE LEISURE CLASS (paraphrased).... > > Skirts tend to be worn as a sign that one doesn't (have to) do any physical > labor. They are worn by a leisure class, either to show how rich the > wearer is OR to show how rich the wearer's owner is. Veblen points out that > in western culture skirts are worn by women and priests (the Catholic > priestly robe). In short, skirts are worn to show one is an item of > conspicuous consumption, either one's own consumption or someone else's. Thorstein Veblen should do a reality check. Did he ever hear of Scotland and kilts? -- Jeff Lichtman at rtech (Relational Technology, Inc.) "Saints should always be judged guilty until they are proved innocent..." {amdahl, sun}!rtech!jeff {ucbvax, decvax}!mtxinu!rtech!jeff
cheryl@lasspvax.UUCP (Cheryl Stewart) (10/25/85)
In article <2402@sdcrdcf.UUCP> barryg@sdcrdcf.UUCP (Lee Gold) writes: > >I think our culture teaches us to confuse competency and stoicism with >masculinity, sensuality and incompetency with femininity. > >--Lee Gold EXACTLY TRUE. Even the phrase "I feel feminine when..." is offensive because it immediately associates femininity with "feelings" and elevates the status of "feelings" to a feminist issue. Men don't say "I feel masculine when...", they say "I prove that I am a man when...." I would say that economic, political and social issues are more important topics than people's feelings, and whether a skirt connotes femininity or how it makes you "feel". I wear a good suit because it is appropriate and important that I do so to maintain an economic, political and social position. Suits for women are skirted. If appropriate suits for women had to be green with orange polka-dots, I would probably wear a green suit with orange polka-dots. Cheryl Stewart
jeffw@tekecs.UUCP (Jeff Winslow) (10/27/85)
> EXACTLY TRUE. Even the phrase "I feel feminine when..." is offensive > because it immediately associates femininity with "feelings" and elevates > the status of "feelings" to a feminist issue. Men don't say "I feel > masculine when...", they say "I prove that I am a man when...." Seems to me I've read about 20 articles in the last two weeks by men who said "I feel masculine when...". On the other hand I have *never* heard a man say "I prove that I am a man when...". I get the giggles just imagining it. C'mon, Cheryl, you don't usually miss. Or have we run up against a local cultural difference? Jeff Winslow
jeff@rtech.UUCP (Jeff Lichtman) (10/31/85)
> In article <2402@sdcrdcf.UUCP> barryg@sdcrdcf.UUCP (Lee Gold) writes: > > > >I think our culture teaches us to confuse competency and stoicism with > >masculinity, sensuality and incompetency with femininity. > > > >--Lee Gold > > EXACTLY TRUE. Even the phrase "I feel feminine when..." is offensive > because it immediately associates femininity with "feelings" and elevates > the status of "feelings" to a feminist issue. Men don't say "I feel > masculine when...", they say "I prove that I am a man when...." HUH!?!?!? I have never heard any man say this, or anything remotely like this. > I would say that economic, political and social issues are more important > topics than people's feelings, and whether a skirt connotes femininity > or how it makes you "feel". > > Cheryl Stewart I couldn't disagree more. Not only are feelings extremely important, they are intimately involved with all of the intellectual issues you listed above. At the root of every belief you have on every topic are your feelings about the topic. This is not to say that feelings and rationality are indistiguishable. They are complementary, and any person who suppresses emotion in favor of intellect (or vice versa) to any large degree is unbalanced. -- Jeff Lichtman at rtech (Relational Technology, Inc.) "Saints should always be judged guilty until they are proved innocent..." {amdahl, sun}!rtech!jeff {ucbvax, decvax}!mtxinu!rtech!jeff
matt@oddjob.UUCP (Matt Crawford) (11/01/85)
Perhaps the two people quoted below really don't disagree, but are just talking about the same thing from different angles. I think that if neither sex is disadvantaged economically, politically or socially, then we (society) will have done the best we can. How a member of either sex feels about doing something or wearing something will then be an internal matter for that person to resolve. At the moment, women are clearly still disadvantaged politically and economically. In my opinion, both men and women are disadvantaged socially because of the unequal treatment given them on the basis of their gender. References: >> I would say that economic, political and social issues are more important >> topics than people's feelings, and whether a skirt connotes femininity >> or how it makes you "feel". >> >> Cheryl Stewart > >I couldn't disagree more. Not only are feelings extremely important, they >are intimately involved with all of the intellectual issues you listed above. >At the root of every belief you have on every topic are your feelings about >the topic. > Jeff Lichtman _____________________________________________________ Matt University crawford@anl-mcs.arpa Crawford of Chicago ihnp4!oddjob!matt