custead@sask.UUCP (Der cuss) (03/06/85)
Someone suggested that this group needs some traffic...so here is a question. About two weeks ago I held (approximately...my memory fades quickly): S Qxx H Axxx D Kx C Jxxx LHO was dealer and opened 1C. Partner overcalled 1D. RHO babbled something to the effect of 1S. I wanted to take some action...we play negative doubles and so I decided to make a 'negative double'. Question: 1) Can this properly be called a negative double, given that LHO opened instead of partner? Is there some other term? 2) Regardless of terminology, is it alertable? (Partner did not alert it.) I certainly don't intend it to be a penalty double. It seems to me that the majority of duplicate players play negative doubles, but they are alertable, and that in standard methods a double after partner has bid is for penalty. (If partner has not bid a double is for takeout.) I don't remember the specific sequence I describe above ever happening to me before. (For the curious, partner bid 2D and played it there, making 3...don't recall if that was a good or bad board.) comments welcome. L. Custead Dept of duplicate Univ of Sask ihnp4!sask!custead
mupmalis@watarts.UUCP (mike upmalis) (03/07/85)
> Someone suggested that this group needs some traffic...so here is a question. > About two weeks ago I held (approximately...my memory fades quickly): > > S Qxx > H Axxx > D Kx > C Jxxx > > LHO was dealer and opened 1C. Partner overcalled 1D. RHO babbled something > to the effect of 1S. I wanted to take some action...we play negative doubles > and so I decided to make a 'negative double'. > Question: > > 1) Can this properly be called a negative double, given that LHO opened > instead of partner? Is there some other term? As always it is a matter of agreement between partners, Whatever you agree it to be, and the ACBL allows, it is. I play this as a negative double. It is the only really sensible use of the double. > > 2) Regardless of terminology, is it alertable? (Partner did not alert it.) > I certainly don't intend it to be a penalty double. > If partner took it as penalty, then he didn't have to alert it. In the absence of an agreement, then partner must decide on interpretation, an proceed on that basis. -- ~~ Mike Upmalis (mupmalis@watarts)<University of Waterloo>
stew@harvard.ARPA (Stew Rubenstein) (03/08/85)
L. Custead (ihnp4!sask!custead) writes: > Someone suggested that this group needs some traffic...so here is a question. > About two weeks ago I held (approximately...my memory fades quickly): > > S Qxx > H Axxx > D Kx > C Jxxx > > LHO was dealer and opened 1C. Partner overcalled 1D. RHO babbled something > to the effect of 1S. I wanted to take some action...we play negative doubles > and so I decided to make a 'negative double'. > Question: > > 1) Can this properly be called a negative double, given that LHO opened > instead of partner? Is there some other term? This bid is called a "responsive double." This hand is a good example. It is also used if partner doubles and RHO bids. For example: S xxx LHO part. RHO you H Qx 1H dbl 2H dbl D Axxx C Kxxx In this case, partner has to have 4 spades for the double, so your responsive double shows values and cards in the minors. > 2) Regardless of terminology, is it alertable? (Partner did not alert it.) > I certainly don't intend it to be a penalty double. Yes, it is alertable. -- ----------------------- Stew Rubenstein UUCP: ihnp4!harvard!stew Harvard Chemistry ARPA: stew@harvard
kfl@cmu-cs-speech2.ARPA (Fu Lee) (03/09/85)
In answer to the question about 1C-1D-1S-Dble:
(1) Double is not negative. Negative double only applies when partner
opened the bidding (usually in a suit), RHO overcalls, and you double.
(2) If you don't have any agreements, this double is for penalties, and
is not alertable. If this double means anything else to your partnership,
then it is alertable.
It is extremely rare that you'd want to make a penalty double in that
situation, so there are a number of conventions you could use (or make up).
The way I play is : In any XX-YY-ZZ-dbl sequence, where XX,YY,ZZ are
all different suit bids, and below 3N, the double means
"I have the fourth suit, plus tolerance for your suit." - something
like xxx Axxxxx Kx Jxx. If ZZ is above 3N, double is for penalties.
If XX and ZZ are the same suit (RHO supported LHO), the double is responsive.
Given the hand Qxx Axxx Kx Jxxx, and without and prior discussion,
I would bid 1N in matchpoints, and 1N or 2D in IMPs or rubber depending
on opponents.
/Kai-Fu