[net.sport.football] Invitation for comment

zzz@mit-eddie.UUCP (Mike Konopik) (11/08/83)

Didja ever notice that when, say, the #3 ranked team beats on the #8 ranked
team, all the polls drop the latter to, oh, about #15 or so? Why is this? I
would think that the latter is SUPPOSED to lose to the former, and that the
loss only strengthens the credibility that one team is better than another.
Why does it necessarily make the latter team worse than other teams ranked
lower than it? The whole thing seems like trying to sort numbers and saying
"3 is before 8, and 3 < 8, so move 8 down some"... I'm sure there are "reasons"
for this behaviour -- I'd like to hear some comments/opinions on it, tho.
-- 

				-Mike

genrad!mit-eddie!zzz  (UUCP)    ZZZ%MIT-OZ@MIT-MC  (ARPA)

djb@cbosgd.UUCP (David J. Bryant) (11/08/83)

	I've noticed the same thing.  As I see it, teams that lose almost
always drop in the ratings. The number of positions they drop is related
to the ranking of the team they lost to.  If #3 beats #8, then #8 is
probably not going to drop more than 2 or 3 positions.  If #8 is beaten
by an unranked team, then #8 can expect to fall quite a distance.  This
situation is aggravated if #8 was #4 last week and lost a game they weren't
supposed to.  This can produce a rapid plummet, perhaps out of the rankings
altogether (similar to what happened with West Virginia and North Carolina 
this season).  I suppose you must consider that #9 and #10 are close in 
strength to #8, and that since they won their games they should move up 
at #8's expense.  The paradox is as you pointed out - you expect #3 to beat
#8, so why should #8 lose ground?  It is as if the #8 team has a feast or
famine future.  If they beat the #3 team, they jump up several spots,
if they lose, they drop several.  No maintaining the status quo. 

	There are all kinds of examples of this phenomenon, with interesting
variations depending on how closly ranked the teams were, whether they were
in the first or second ten, etc.  It's a common enough occurrance that most
pollsters must just do reflexively.  Still, it's curious...

	Another more unusual case is when a team loses and moves up.  This
happened this past week with E. Carolina.  They played Miami (Florida) a
great game and lost in the last few minutes.  As a result (plus based on
their strong showings earlier in the season) got them rated #25 in this 
week's USA TODAY Top 25, where they were unranked the week before.

	David Bryant   Bell Labs   Columbus, OH   (614) 860-4516
	(cbosg!djb)

beth@umcp-cs.UUCP (11/10/83)

Let's make this a more concrete discussion.  Auburn (#3) beat Maryland (#7)
by 12 points on a last few seconds touchdown on a fumble recovery.  Maryland
had shown on a previous drive that they could march 99 yards for a touchdown.
It was Auburn's homecoming.  Maryland is now 7-2.  In the coaches' poll,
Maryland was ranked #17 after that loss.  The sportswriters ranked them #11.
Seems that the coaches looked at the final score and/or don't take Bobby Ross
(the Maryland coach) very seriously.  Maryland is ranked just above North
Carolina (who plays a teribly weak schedule) and behind West Virginia (who
beat Maryland) and Pittsburg (beaten by Maryland when Maryland was using their
second string quarterback).  Now if Maryland loses to Clemson, maybe the
coaches were justified, but I think they aren't really paying much attention
to how other teams, particularly those that don't have national exposure, are
playing.
					--Beth Katz