phipps@fortune.UUCP (Clay Phipps) (02/02/84)
The claim that there are no such things as "innocent civilians" in total war
is fallacious; "innocent civilians" are those who were involved,
without their consent, in a war by the decisions of their government
or some other government.
Ironically, by my definition, citizens of totalitarian states,
be they rightist or leftist, are the most "innocent".
They have little or no say in how their government behaves.
As far as voting is concerned, there may be a pseudoelection to ratify
a single-party slate of "candidates", or no election at all.
When was the last time that the people of the Soviet Union got to choose
between a pacifist and a warmonger (or make any choice at all)
for president of their country ?
In the democracies, the citizens sometimes have the *opportunity*
to make clear choices between "peace-loving" and "warmongering" candidates,
or between deployment of nuclear weapons and nondeployment
(as was the case in recent European elections) so citizens of these countries
must take some responsibility for the actions of their leaders.
They also have less of a claim of innocence.
If Reagan starts a major war, we must keep in mind that at least some of us
voted for him. Of course, not all of the citizens are old enough to vote.
By the way, the fallout and other side effects from a nuclear war
are not likely to be so well behaved as to stop precisely at the borders
of only those countries who are voluntarily involved in the war.
I'm sure that this has a lot (everything ?) to do with the strong opinions
held by our Canadian neighbors and European allies.
-- Clay Phipps
--
{allegra,amd70,cbosgd,dsd,floyd,harpo,hpda,ihnp4,
megatest,nsc,oliveb,sri-unix,twg,varian,VisiA,wdl1}
!fortune!phippssaquigley@watmath.UUCP (Sophie Quigley) (02/08/84)
> Citizens of a totalitarian state must take responsibility > (in some sense) for allowing their country to remain totalitarian. > Admittedly, some totalitarian governments are better entrenched than others, > e.g., the Kremlin in comparison to the average banana dictatorship. > > Nobody ever said resistance or revolution was easy, did they ? I think you must have forgotten a (:-)) somewhere in there. In other words, are you SERIOUS? Sophie Quigley watmath!saquigley
mlh@abnjh.UUCP (M. L. Holt) (02/08/84)
Yes, Sophie, all citizens really are responsible for their government's activities; in the long run people get the kind and quality of government they deserve (corporately, but not necessarily individually). Mike Holt njuxh!mlh
phipps@fortune.UUCP (Clay Phipps) (02/15/84)
I overlooked at least one point in my original follow-up posting
(this is not to say that I haven't provoked flames already):
Citizens of a totalitarian state must take responsibility
(in some sense) for allowing their country to remain totalitarian.
Admittedly, some totalitarian governments are better entrenched than others,
e.g., the Kremlin in comparison to the average banana dictatorship.
Nobody ever said resistance or revolution was easy, did they ?
-- Clay Phipps
--
{allegra,amd70,cbosgd,dsd,floyd,harpo,hpda,ihnp4,
megatest,nsc,oliveb,sri-unix,twg,varian,VisiA,wdl1}
!fortune!phipps