alle@ihuxb.UUCP (Allen England) (03/06/84)
+ The idea of a "zero sum gain" is very popular among those who feel that capitalists (whoever that is) exploit the workers, the people, etc. This idea is based on the notion that in every business transaction, one person gains something and the other person loses something resulting in no net gain (a zero sum gain). I know of no economists who support this position. If person a sells item x to person b for y dollars, then person a gained y dollars, person b gained item x but lost y dollars. The net gain is NOT zero. Person a gained y dollars in value (and clearly item x was valued at <= y dollars) and person b gained the value of item x (>= y dollars) while giving up y dollars. In the general case, both sides gain something. Thus, no zero sum gain. If a factory owner "exploits" his workers "stealing" the products of their labor without paying the workers for their work, that is called slavery. If he pays them for their labor (but at a value less than the retail value of the products), then they gain the salary while giving up their labor. The factory owner gains the product while giving up the salaries of the workers. If either side is receiving less than it is giving, then logically, the transaction should be stopped. I don't mean to be so pedantic here, but I am disturbed by those who insist on believing that one side loses while one side wins in every transaction. That runs counter to Economics and is normally used to justify taking from those who have more than some group (i.e. soaking the wealthy). Allen England at AT&T Bell Laboratories, Naperville, IL ihnp4!ihuxb!alle
myers@uwvax.ARPA (03/07/84)
In order to understand the notion that capitalists exploit workers, you need
to know something about the labor theory of value. Check out the first five
or six chapters of *Capital* vol. 1 by K. Marx. If that looks too demanding,
try the pamphlet, by the same author, titled "Wages, Price, and Profit".
--
Jeff Myers Motto: "Reactionaries are people, too."
ARPA: myers@uwisc
uucp: ..{seismo, ihnp4}!wisc-rsch!myersdavid@randvax.ARPA (David Shlapak) (03/08/84)
Everybody, please...the phrase is "zero sum GAME," not "gain"....
ags@pucc-i (Seaman) (03/09/84)
> The idea of a "zero sum gain" is very popular among those who feel > that capitalists (whoever that is) exploit the workers, the people, > etc. That's "zero sum GAME," not gain. The term comes from the mathematical theory of games. A game is called "zero sum" if the sum of the payoffs to the participants is zero. An example of a zero-sum game is poker. When John Kennedy said, "A rising tide lifts all boats," he was taking the position that the economy is not a zero-sum game. -- Dave Seaman ..!pur-ee!pucc-i:ags "Against people who give vent to their loquacity by extraneous bombastic circumlocution."