keduh@hogpd.UUCP (D.HUDEK) (03/23/84)
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Aarrrgggghhhhhhh!!!!!!!
If people are going to debate about prayer in school, let's
at least all use the same terminology.
Please correct me if I'm wrong { I have no fears on that
score :-) }, but there currently IS NO law (USA) that prohibits
an individual from quietly praying in school. Why do people
claim there is ?? Where is it ? Give me a reference. If one is
sitting in class and has the urge, he/she is perfectly free
to quietly pray to their God. What they may not do is
disrupt the rest of the class by shouting Hosannahs or
dancing around. Silent (or murmured or any other non-disruptive)
prayer is quite all right. If you lose track of what the
teacher is saying, that's your fault-- pick a better time.
They also may not force the rest of the class to imitate their
specific behavior of a religious nature.
Seems reasonable enough to me.
So when someone says prayer is currently banned from school,
they are NOT telling you the truth. What they mean to say is that ORGANIZED,
MANDATORY, LEGISLATED, "USE THESE EXACT WORDS CHILDREN OR ELSE YOU'LL
GO TO HELL" - prayer is illegal, except if they called it that, no one
would support them.
Now, maybe that was a little too sarcastic, but this has hit a
raw nerve. The point is that children may pray in school if they
want to. WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT MORE THAN THAT ?? I would certainly
be on "school-prayer's" side if they meant what they said, but they
don't seem to. They claim that prayer has been banned... BALONEY !!
They seem to want to regulate exactly what and when children pray.
WHY ??!!?? Is it some monstrous kind of power trip ? Are they
THAT insecure about their religion ?? I know it's cliche, but...
talk about Big Brother !!
AS AN ASIDE:
Besides, what is so damn special about praying IN school ?
Why not... when you wake up, as you go to school, on the way
home, at dinner, in the toilet :-), before bed, etc.
School only takes up a fraction of the day. If parents feel
strongly about the issue... let them teach their kids at home.
I wonder how many parents who want state-run prayer are at the
same time against state-run sex education ??? It would be
most informative to see how they would justify their position.
EDISA
As far as I know, this is the current status. If I am wrong,
I apologize and retract my earlier statements, but it's going
to take quite a bit of proof to convince me. I'm all for freedom
of religion and against suppression of religion, but by the
same token I am against arbitrary state-enforced support
of religion (for if the state supports one, it suppresses
another at the same time). I must confess to being somewhat
bewildered by the whole "debate". It seems so entrenched in
double-speak that it's hard to follow.
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| ` ' | {ihnp4! or pegasus!} hogpd!keduh
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\___/ron@brl-vgr.ARPA (Ron Natalie <ron>) (03/24/84)
No there is nothing that prevents the students from doing whatever they want. The law prevents the TEACHERS from practically mentioning religion or God at all. What the furor is over is allowing teachers to say at the beginning of the day "Let's all pray for a minute." -Ron
jrt@hou5g.UUCP (03/26/84)
>> Please correct me if I'm wrong { I have no fears on that >> score :-) }, but there currently IS NO law (USA) that prohibits >> an individual from quietly praying in school. Why do people >> claim there is ?? >> >> So when someone says prayer is currently banned from school, >> they are NOT telling you the truth. What they mean to say is that ORGANIZED, >> MANDATORY, LEGISLATED, "USE THESE EXACT WORDS CHILDREN OR ELSE YOU'LL >> GO TO HELL" - prayer is illegal, except if they called it that, no one >> would support them. >> >> AS AN ASIDE: >> Besides, what is so damn special about praying IN school ? Correction follows: The law states a little more than that. It is also illegal for you to silently pray, if you do so in front of others. It is also illegal for the school to set aside a little "quiet time" where you may pray if you like, silently to yourself. It is also illegal for a group (2 or more people) to get together by themselves on school property, and pray. also, these laws extend not only to schools, but to public places and state and federal buildings, such as libraries, courts of law, jails, etc. Learn ALL the law, before you start flaming...... (** FRODO **) alias hou5g!jrt
hutch@shark.UUCP (Stephen Hutchison) (03/26/84)
<Let us prey (sic)> One thing to remember while blasting away about how you are free to pray in a non-disruptive fashion in school, is that some religions (Islam) do require that you pray at given times of day, and that you do so in a set fashion (visible, disruptive, getting out of chair, laying out prayer rug, praying out loud) and that it is NOT legal as interpreted by most schools for a student to request a place where this cannot disturb other students. Hutch