arndt@lymph.DEC (03/10/85)
Hi DAVE: How are you? I am fine. I have some friends from up in our next state who made some interesting comments about the "french language" problem. You may notice that the separatists are melting away up there? Anyway, their kids are in the language immersion program in the public schools (learning french) and they see what has happened as another stupid self-shafting by those frenchmen who insist on maintaining two languages up there. That is, now that english speaking kids are coming up (fast- the first classes are starting to graduate) and into the business world, THEY are the ones who will profit by being able to move into the better jobs in the business world where French needs to be spoken. Know why? Well, it's because they have learned French correctly!!!! Not the mongrel patois the 'French' up there speak! And the French 'speaking' kids are not doing so well learning to speak their own language correctly. The French know this and are upset. Any knowledge of this you can shed for us? Anyone else? Hope this isn't too innane for you. Listen, let's be friends. I'm sorry to have jumped on you a while ago. You must admit I have reason to be a little 'gun shy' upon occasion. I've enjoyed reading your postings. (except for that one!) Keep 'em coming. Best regards, Ken Arndt
dharris@watarts.UUCP (Dave Harris) (03/11/85)
> > Hi DAVE: > > How are you? I am fine. > > I have some friends from up in our next state who made some interesting > comments about the "french language" problem. You may notice that the > separatists are melting away up there? Anyway, their kids are in the > language immersion program in the public schools (learning french) and > they see what has happened as another stupid self-shafting by those > frenchmen who insist on maintaining two languages up there. That is, now > that english speaking kids are coming up (fast- the first classes are starting > to graduate) and into the business world, THEY are the ones who will profit > by being able to move into the better jobs in the business world where French > needs to be spoken. Know why? Well, it's because they have learned French > correctly!!!! Not the mongrel patois the 'French' up there speak! And the > French 'speaking' kids are not doing so well learning to speak their own > language correctly. The French know this and are upset. Whoa!!! Kindly allow me to correct a few errors: 1) Frenchmen live in France (and they mostly spell it with a capital F). In Canada, we have francophones. Similarly, Englishmen come from England. Canada has few Englishmen. We call them anglophones. 2) Not everybody in Quebec is thrilled about being educated in French. In fact, many are not. The new language laws are forcing a lot of parents who would normally have their children educated in English to send them to French schools, no disussion. These people are not amused, and many have chosen to leave la belle province. 3) (from the Canadian Living Webster Encyclopedic Dictionary of the English Language): PATOIS: A dialect differing from the standard language of the country; a provincial or illiterate form of speech; the jargon of a social or professional group. What exactly is a `mongrel patois'? That would seem to be redundant. In any case, Canadian French is a dialect, not a patois. In fact, it is far closer to the French spoken in France in the XVI and XVII centuries. It is not illiterate. It does not differ from the standard language of the country, because it IS the standard French of Canada. It is not the jargon of any one social or professional group. Ergo, Canadian French is *NOT* a patois. Q.E.D. 4) All the Canadian francophones I know are not too upset about not speaking whathey call `francais francais'. They make fun of it, In fact, they make more fun of the way Frenchmen speak than Frenchmen do of the way Quebecois speak. By the way, PLEASE do not EVER refer to standard French as 'Parisian' French. That's one of my pet peeves. Parisian French is one of the most God-awful accents I've ever heard, and NOBODY teaches it (except perhaps Parisians in Paris). The world standard is, of all things, called `francais standard', and the region that comes closest to that is Tours, in France. So if `standard French' bothers you, at least call it `Touraine French'. It would make me very happy. -- - Dave Harris, Arts Computing Office University of Waterloo Waterloo, Ontario, Canada