sdd@pyuxh.UUCP (S Daniels) (06/28/85)
A New York appeals court refused to dismiss the Bernhard Goetz case yesterday. Goetz is free on $5000 bail. In the words of a New York radio station, "Goetz is charged with attempted murder of four teenagers who asked him for money on a subway." My, how perceptions have changed over time. -- Steve Daniels (!pyuxh!sdd) "I'm counting the smiles on the road to Utopia."
dimitrov@csd2.UUCP (Isaac Dimitrovsky) (07/01/85)
[] >A New York appeals court refused to dismiss the Bernhard Goetz case yesterday. >Goetz is free on $5000 bail. In the words of a New York radio station, >"Goetz is charged with attempted murder of four teenagers who asked >him for money on a subway." The other day, one of the teenagers shot by Goetz (James Ramseur) was arrested for raping and robbing an eighteen year old woman on the roof of an apartment building in the Bronx housing project where he (Ramseur) lives. He is also being questioned about the rape and murder of another woman on the same rooftop earlier, although he is apparently not the main suspect in this case (he was identified by the eighteen year old in a police lineup). Isaac Dimitrovsky allegra!cmcl2!csd2!dimitrov (l in cmcl2 is letter l not number 1) 251 Mercer Street, New York NY 10012 Just because it's a preconceived notion doesn't mean it's wrong!
renner@uiucdcs.Uiuc.ARPA (07/03/85)
> A New York appeals court refused to dismiss the Bernhard Goetz case > yesterday. Goetz is free on $5000 bail. In the words of a New York > radio station, "Goetz is charged with attempted murder of four > teenagers who asked him for money on a subway." According to a recent article in the Chicago Tribute, one of those four teenagers has since been arrested for rape and armed robbery. The victim identified him in a lineup. He's learning fast: this time he had a gun instead of a screwdriver. This probably won't change Goetz's legal problems. It may not change your opinion of what Goetz did. But I'll bet that somewhere in New York there's a woman who wishes that Bernard Goetz was a better shot. Scott Renner ihnp4!uiucdcs!renner
cramer@kontron.UUCP (Clayton Cramer) (07/05/85)
> [] > > >A New York appeals court refused to dismiss the Bernhard Goetz case yesterday. > >Goetz is free on $5000 bail. In the words of a New York radio station, > >"Goetz is charged with attempted murder of four teenagers who asked > >him for money on a subway." > > The other day, one of the teenagers shot by Goetz (James Ramseur) > was arrested for raping and robbing an eighteen year old woman > on the roof of an apartment building in the Bronx housing project > where he (Ramseur) lives. He is also being questioned about the > rape and murder of another woman on the same rooftop earlier, > although he is apparently not the main suspect in this case > (he was identified by the eighteen year old in a police lineup). > > Isaac Dimitrovsky Makes you wish Goetz carried a more effective handgun.
mrh@cybvax0.UUCP (Mike Huybensz) (07/06/85)
In article <29200235@uiucdcs> renner@uiucdcs.Uiuc.ARPA writes: > > > A New York appeals court refused to dismiss the Bernhard Goetz case > > yesterday. Goetz is free on $5000 bail. In the words of a New York > > radio station, "Goetz is charged with attempted murder of four > > teenagers who asked him for money on a subway." > > According to a recent article in the Chicago Tribute, one of those four > teenagers has since been arrested for rape and armed robbery. The victim > identified him in a lineup. He's learning fast: this time he had a gun > instead of a screwdriver. > > This probably won't change Goetz's legal problems. It may not change your > opinion of what Goetz did. But I'll bet that somewhere in New York there's > a woman who wishes that Bernard Goetz was a better shot. > > Scott Renner I suppose that by that standard, we should all hope you are shot dead before you might commit a crime in the future. It's easy to wish away due process of law for people you dislike or fear. But the cost is too high, as numberless tyrants and revolutions have shown. -- Mike Huybensz ...decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!cybvax0!mrh
csdf@mit-vax.UUCP (Charles Forsythe) (07/09/85)
In article <599@cybvax0.UUCP> mrh@cybvax0.UUCP (Mike Huybensz) writes: >> This probably won't change Goetz's legal problems. It may not change your >> opinion of what Goetz did. But I'll bet that somewhere in New York there's >> a woman who wishes that Bernard Goetz was a better shot. >> >> Scott Renner > >I suppose that by that standard, we should all hope you are shot dead before >you might commit a crime in the future. > >It's easy to wish away due process of law for people you dislike or fear. >But the cost is too high, as numberless tyrants and revolutions have >shown. >Mike Huybensz ...decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!cybvax0!mrh Actually, he was suggesting that the youth (should/could?) have been shot during a crime, not before it. It's absurd to think that you would shoot a potential criminal, but shooting a current criminal is a different story. (I'm not saying I support that, just getting stories straight). -- Charles Forsythe CSDF@MIT-VAX "The Church of Fred has yet to come under attack. No one knows about it." -Rev. Wang Zeep
mrh@cybvax0.UUCP (Mike Huybensz) (07/10/85)
In article <334@mit-vax.UUCP> csdf@mit-vax.UUCP (Charles Forsythe) writes: > >> Scott Renner: > >> This probably won't change Goetz's legal problems. It may not change your > >> opinion of what Goetz did. But I'll bet that somewhere in New York there's > >> a woman who wishes that Bernard Goetz was a better shot. > > Actually, he was suggesting that the youth (should/could?) have been > shot during a crime, not before it. It's absurd to think that you would > shoot a potential criminal, but shooting a current criminal is a > different story. (I'm not saying I support that, just getting stories > straight). No. None of the 4 youths Goetz shot have been convicted of anything concerning Goetz. To wish that Goetz had killed him is to wish for summary justice for crimes not yet proven, rather than justice for crimes in commission. Whether the crime in commission is rape or jaywalking, wishing Goetz had killed him is to wish for no due process. But it is quite a normal human wish. -- Mike Huybensz ...decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!cybvax0!mrh
dimitrov@csd2.UUCP (Isaac Dimitrovsky) (07/12/85)
[] > None of the 4 youths Goetz shot have been convicted of anything > concerning Goetz. If you want to be technical about it, Goetz has not been convicted of shooting them either. Isaac Dimitrovsky allegra!cmcl2!csd2!dimitrov (l in cmcl2 is letter l not number 1) 251 Mercer Street, New York NY 10012 Just because it's a preconceived notion doesn't mean it's wrong!
mrh@cybvax0.UUCP (Mike Huybensz) (07/13/85)
In article <3630010@csd2.UUCP> dimitrov@csd2.UUCP (Isaac Dimitrovsky) writes: > > None of the 4 youths Goetz shot have been convicted of anything > > concerning Goetz. > > If you want to be technical about it, Goetz has not been > convicted of shooting them either. If you want to be technical about it, I didn't say shooting was a crime of which Goetz was convicted. 1) Goetz is not accused of "shooting": there probably isn't such a crime on the books. (I don't think the second grand jury has indited him yet.) 2) Goetz admitted that he shot the youths, and the youths did have bullet wounds. This is a fact established by assorted legal standards (for example by the first grand jury.) -- Mike Huybensz ...decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!cybvax0!mrh