martillo@csd2.UUCP (Joachim Martillo) (08/21/85)
/* csd2:net.politics / sweillam@uw-june (Hisham Sweillam) / 2:38 pm Jul 26, 1985 */ >>>From: ethan@utastro.UUCP (Ethan Vishniac) >>>First, isn't it obvious that whatever the goals and ideals of various >>>moslems Mr. Martillo is the only one in this discussion with the slightest >>>idea of what it means to be a minority in a conservative moslem nation? >Mr. Ethan it's obvious that the above statement is not true. Is it my >obvious or your obvious that is obviously obvious?! There is strong evidence that my mother's family, the `Ajamis, have lived in N. Africa since at least Roman times. They lived as dhimmis (non-Muslim subject people) for approximately a millenium. Even though I have never lived as a dhimmi (al-hamdu lillah!), I probably have a better idea what it is to be a non-Muslim in a conservative Muslim country than some random Muslim bigot off the street. >Until we settle this down let me argue using the sacred words of Mr. Martillo >(the only authoritative person to talk about Islam and Muslim countries; >never mind the fact that he's not muslim and that he's not from a Moslem >country): Granted I was not born in a Muslim country (al-hamdu lillah!), I have lived in Morocco, Turkey and Egypt. Also in college, I roomed with the son of Egyptian government official for a time, and am on rather good terms with a high Syrian government official because I beat the brains out of a guy who was trying to rape his daughter while she was a student at an American university. My father used to travel rather frequently to most of the countries in the Middle East and N. Africa and we used to host his business acquaintances now and then. I have some idea what goes on in the area and in the minds of Muslims. At least I would visit the suq unlike my Egyptian roommate. >Mr. Martillo says (hold your breath, these are his own words): >>>> By the way I do not conceal my background, but to be honest >>>> in any discussion of the middle east you should tell us whether you are >>>> some sort of Muslim or rather an Armenian just brown-nosing your former >>>> Muslim masters. >Mr. martillo is addressing Mokhtarian who at some insane moment decided to >dispute with Mr. Martillo about his authorized statements (authorized >statements don't need support or analysis for why they're made). >I'm not trying to defend or reply for Mokhtarian , he seems to know how to >reply in a witty and civilized manner; but I'm pointing out to the fact that >Mr. martillo acknowledges the fact that there are minorities that lived >unharmed in Muslim countries, he acknowldges also the fact that they >understood these people and can talk on behalf of them. >I've no idea about Mokhtarian ethnic background, but this has nothing to >do with the above analysis. I suppose you never heard that Turkish and Kurdish Muslims slaughtered the Armenians, but I guess murdering non-Muslims does not count as mistreatment. Nowadays some Armenians act as apologists for Muslim barbarism sometimes because of some variant of the Stockholm syndrome othertimes because they still have interests or relatives hostage in Muslim countries, but I have the impression that most Armenians rather thoroughly despise Muslims.