pagiven@drutx.UUCP (GivenP) (12/04/84)
- Thanks to Jeff and others for contributing their ideas to the ski selection confabulation. I'm sticking to my guns, however, on choosing both unused equipment and top-of-the-line competition slalom skis. >From: jm@tekig.UUCP (Jeff Mizener) >2) Paul says: "NEVER BUY USED EQUIPMENT". I disagree. Strongly. Especially > if the purchaser in question is a beginner. There is no reason to assume > that a ski may be no good just because it's used. Skis are remarkably tough. > If a ski looks ok on the top and bottom, chances are that it's in good > shape. How do we know this? Well, the top gets banged around each time > you use it, so it's condition is a good indicator of the condition to > the internal structure of the ski. If the top sheet has tiny cracks that > run across the ski near the shovel or tail, then care is urged. However, > compared with the cost of new equipment, used skis can be a real bargain. > Another factor to consider is bindings. Bindings last a long time. They > don't wear out easily. If a ski is a couple of seasons old, not only are > the chances good that the ski's still good, but that the bindings are good > too. A $250 pair of skis and a $100 set of bindings will cost about $150 > (depending on condition) a year or two later. This is a big savings. > The best thing to do is take along a friend skilled in such things when > you go used-ski-shopping. First off, I'm sure you agree, *rank* beginners should be renting, not buying, at least until such time as they can negotiate beginner slopes safely and they know that skiing is enjoyable enough for them to make the financial commitment required. Will such a skier recognize a good used ski as opposed to a worn out one? Will the skier know that lateral crazing along the shovel is bad? or that the slightest laminar separation near the binding is disaster? I would be hard pressed to tell you how many belt- sander bottom jobs a ski has had, and therefore how much ptex or edge material is left. There is (was?) a clear plastic mylar pro- duct made to cover the ski tops to prevent scratching or other obvious signs of wear. With that stuff peeled off, an old ski could look pretty good to an untrained eye. I once had a binding pull out of a ski with one edge badly ripped off. The ski was almost entirely delaminated. Since they were under warranty, I sent them back to the factory. Would you believed they *repaired* them? I thought for sure they would have to be replaced! They came back looking like new but skied like barrel staves! Within the first two runs, the ski edge had pulled off again. Finally, near the end of last season, I purchased *brand new* K2 712 Comps (204 cm) for $110. With that price, why should I take a chance on used equipment? My brand new Tyrolia 380s were $90. >3) Paul sez: > "Always get the top of the line, competition ski in any > of the BIG NAME brands. ... Don't let the fact that you are > an intermediate/beginner skier, sway you into buying less that the > competition version. Those soft, forgiving skis will be good for > one or two days at the outside, before you are ready for something > better. The intermediate versions WILL hold back your progress. > Always get the Slalom version competition ski. Forget Giant Slalom > (GS), or any other version (unless you are in to specialty racing > events). Slalom skis can be designed using side cut, flex pattern, > or both." > > Pardon me, but most of that is bullshit. Pure and unadulterated. > Let's take that one point at a time. > a) You can go broke buying the top of the line competition ski. > You can also hurt yourself. Racing skis arr designed for > racing. If you aren't gonna race (or if you don't go real fast > alot) DON'T BY SUPER HOT RACING SKIS. They are designed to be > just marginally stable, so they turn fast. They take a great > deal of effort and an experienced skiier to control. They will > screw up a beginner/intermediate because those people don't have > as fine a control over their bodies (while skiing) as do experts/racers. > I know this from my experience as a ski instructor. > b) Who said that anything but racing skis were "soft, forgiving". > And furthermore, why is this bad for the average skiier interested > in advancing? An unforgiving ski is just that, unforgiving. A little > too much edge and ZAP you're in a turn you hadn't intended to make. > c) Contrary to Paul's assertion, a ski that's too unforgiving will hold > you back more than a ski that's too forgiving. An unforgiving ski > will fustrate you more than anything. If you buy new skis at the end of the season, or new year old skis at the beginning of next season, you needn't go broke, as illus- trated above. Most ski companies manufacture both a competition version and a SUPER HOT RACING version. The recommendation here is for the competition ski, as most places can get the SUPER HOT RAC- ING version only on special order. Competition versions are usu- ally detuned super hot's, and less carefully matched as a pair. Competition skis don't take more effort to control, they take less! And they are more stable at higher speeds (not marginally stable), but that does not make them less stable at slower speeds. Most beginner/intermediates are fearful of higher speeds because their skis feel so *unstable* (How many times, Jeff, have you heard: "My tips feel like their wandering!"). And from my experience as a ski instructor, ski patroller (Hunter Mountain, New York), and ardent NASTAR racer, I find that most b/i skiers quickly grasp the notions of lower body independent leg action but cannot make their skis do what the instructor's can! So what do they do? They make exaggerated, usually upper body (which is, of course, wrong, wrong, wrong), movements to force those "for- giving" skis into a nice crisp round turn with minimum sideslip. I find that b/i skiers on new competition skis, although at first are way overcontrolling, quickly compensate to make the more subtle ("quiet") movements required for the better skis. > d) WHY, for the god's sake, DO WE ALWAYS HAVE TO BUY THE SLALOM SKI??? > Doesn't this depend on the type of terrain that you are planning to > ski? A slalom ski is cut to be less stable than a GS or a Downhill > ski. Why? So it will turn faster! Most intermediates I have known > aren't looking to make a lot of short, fast snap turns. It is > considerably easier to make quick turns on a GS ski than it is to make > a Slalom ski hold a line at high speed. My feeling is that if there > is a choice between an intermediate GS or S ski for an intermediate > skiier, choose the GS ski. Buy a S ski when you take up racing > (which is fun, try it!). My experience has shown otherwise, Jeff. Most b/i skiers *want* to make short radius turns to help keep speed under control. Many would like to be able to ski mogul fields. Have you ever had fun skiing moguls with GS skis? In general recreational skiing, peo- ple, I believe, have greater immediate need for making short radius turns (narrow trails, mogul fields, fast deceleration) than for sweeping, fast, large radius turns (which are great fun on flat b/i terrain). Of course, this is individual taste, but I was making my observations based on my personal experiences with *most* b/i skiers. > e) A slalom ski is made using BOTH side cut and flex, not one OR the > other. True. Not like they used to do in the old days. Thanks for the correction. In summary, I think one point, at least, is agreed upon and impor- tant. Ideally, rent the ski you plan to buy. If *you* like it, then it is the ski for you! BTW, from time to time, a ski company van will make an appearance at a ski area to show off their pro- ducts on the snow. This is a golden opportunity to try various models and lengths of one company's skis. Even if you aren't in the market for skis, the experience gained will benefit when you are. ----------------------------------------------------------------- Paul Given {ihnp4, houxe, stcvax!ihnp4}!drutx!pagiven AT&T Information Systems Laboratories 11900 N. Pecos, Rm 1B04, Denver 80234 (303)-538-4058 -----------------------------------------------------------------