jeff@dciem.UUCP (Jeff Richardson) (02/17/86)
Glen Sather should not be allowed to coach the All-Star team. Either
that or the rules should be tightened up so that he can't do what he did
this year. The rules say that after the fans pick the starters (in previous
years the starters were picked by a vote of writers, I think), the coach
gets to pick the rest of the players for his team. The fans didn't do too
badly, but I don't think they based their selections entirely on this seasons
performances, as they should have. (Fuhr and Gosselin should not have been in
the game; Moog and Froese should have been the starters with Wamsley and
Vanbiesbrouck backing them up, and Naslund should have been picked ahead of
Goulet).
Anyway, back to Sather. He put nine Oilers on the team, though you can't
blame him for Fuhr's presence. Most of them deserved it, but picking Lee
Fogolin and Kevin Lowe, while people like Al MacInnis, and Reed Larson
were ignored was ridiculous. Not only that, even though there were
four forward lines and three defence pairings on the team, Gretzky's line
with Coffey and Wilson on defence (I guess Wilson was there as a token non-
Oiler so that it wouldn't look too obvious) played at least half of the
third period and most of the overtime. I don't remember seeing Neal Broten on
the ice at all during the game, and Gary Suter, Rob Ramage and Mark Hunter
didn't seem to get much ice time either. Even Ogrodnick, Savard, Tanti and
Taylor almost disappeared once the third period got going. Sather was probably
playing to win by using his best players, but the all-star game is supposed to
be a showcase of the best players from every team. With Sather coaching, we
don't get to see half of them. With most teams only playing each other three
times a season, we don't get to see most of these players enough.
I don't object to having the Stanley Cup champs play the all-stars; in fact
I think it's a great idea because it gives the stars from the other teams a
chance to beat the champs, and because it gives a good comparison of the team
concept against a set of individual stars. They should make it official though
so that we'll at least get to see some of the other stars from the Campbell
Conference for more than just a couple of shifts. Another format I would
like to see is Canadian-born all stars against Americans and Europeans. In my
opinion, both of these formats are highly preferable to Campbell vs. Wales
or NHL all-stars vs. Russians.
--
Jeff Richardson, DCIEM, Toronto (416) 635-2073
{linus,ihnp4,uw-beaver,floyd}!utcsri!dciem!jeff
{allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!dciem!jeffguest@ihlpl.UUCP (Strugalla) (02/18/86)
> Most of them deserved it, but picking Lee > Fogolin and Kevin Lowe, while people like Al MacInnis, and Reed Larson > were ignored was ridiculous. REED LARSON????????? You've GOT to be kidding! He's the WORST excuse for a defenseman I've EVER seen! Take a look at the goals-allowed totals for the Red Wings during the "Larson dynasty" and you'll see what I mean. Sure, he has a monster slapshot but for every goal he scores he gives up two because of his INEPT stick-handling. Any trade the Wings could make to UNLOAD this parasite would make me happy. Peter Gayde (a die-hard Detroit sports fan) AT&T Information Systems Naperville, IL ..!ihnp4!iwsl7!gayde
ken@alberta.UUCP (Ken Hruday) (02/18/86)
> Glen Sather should not be allowed to coach the All-Star team.
Despite the fact that I'm an Oilers fan I have to agree. But I suspect
that any active coach in the league would be somewhat partisan to his
own players. The only solution that I see is to bring back a retired coach
from former years to coach and select the remaining all stars. This would
allow a more balanced team and also give the league a chance to honor
one of its former great coaches. How about Don Cherry for next years
all star team :-) :-).
Ken Hruday
University of Albertajhr2@houem.UUCP (J.ROSENBLUTH) (02/18/86)
> The fans didn't do too > badly, but I don't think they based their selections entirely on this seasons > performances, as they should have. Why? Josh Rosenbluth (...!houxm!houem!jhr2)
jim@hcrvax.UUCP (Jim Sullivan) (02/19/86)
> discussion about Glen Sather loading the All-Star team with Oilers
Since I don't agree with the fans voting for the All-Star team, I might
be a little biased here, but, who cares.
If we are going to see the fans picking the starting team, why not have
the writers or the other coaches pick the remaining team members. In
this way, a majority of the All-Stars would be picked properly, with
'experts' doing the picking. It prevents any coach from stacking his
team with players from his team, and removes the problem of having the
All-Star team being the result of a popularity contest.
Really, the fans shouldn't pick the teams, and I don't watch the All-Star
games when they do.
Jim Sullivanabsary@water.UUCP (Al Sary) (02/19/86)
In article <809@alberta.UUCP> ken@alberta.UUCP (Ken Hruday) writes: >> Glen Sather should not be allowed to coach the All-Star team. > > Despite the fact that I'm an Oilers fan I have to agree. But I suspect >that any active coach in the league would be somewhat partisan to his >own players. The only solution that I see is to bring back a retired coach >from former years to coach and select the remaining all stars. This would >allow a more balanced team and also give the league a chance to honor >one of its former great coaches. How about Don Cherry for next years >all star team :-) :-). That's not a bad idea; not necessarily an former coach, but someone other than the all star team coaches should select the rest of the team. Fogolin on the all-star team; that's a real joke. -- Al Sary, CS Dep., U. of Waterloo, Waterloo, Ontario, Canada, N2L 3G1 UUCP: ...!{utzoo|decvax|ihnp4|clyde|allegra|linus}!watmath!watcal!absary ARPA: absary%watcal%waterloo.csnet@csnet-relay.arpa CSNET: absary%watcal@waterloo.CSNET
johansen@agrigene.UUCP (02/22/86)
> Glen Sather should not be allowed to coach the All-Star team. Either > that or the rules should be tightened up so that he can't do what he did > this year. The rules say that after the fans pick the starters (in previous > years the starters were picked by a vote of writers, I think), the coach > gets to pick the rest of the players for his team. The fans didn't do too > badly, but I don't think they based their selections entirely on this seasons > performances, as they should have. (Fuhr and Gosselin should not have been in > the game; Grant Fuhr was named outstanding player in the game. How can you argue that he did not belong? > Another format I would > like to see is Canadian-born all stars against Americans and Europeans. I don't think there are enough good American and European players to make a real all-star team. If I remember correctly, only about 20% of the players are not Canadian born. Has any american born player scored over 100 points in a season? (Bobby Carpenter?). The Canadian team would easily have a dozen players who have accomplished this at least once in their careers.
rick@ucla-cs.UUCP (02/23/86)
In article <1789@dciem.UUCP> jeff@dciem.UUCP (Jeff Richardson) writes: >Glen Sather should not be allowed to coach ... > ... > Even Ogrodnick, Savard, Tanti and >Taylor almost disappeared once the third period got going. Actually, what I noticed was that Savard was invisible for the first two periods but then he got tons of ice time in the 3rd. He was on for each power play (as I recall) and played well, I thought. He was even out there when they pulled Moog for the extra attacker. An observation for the All-Star game: Paul Coffey has regressed this year. He may be going great guns on offense but he looks lost in his own zone. Two of the Wales' goals were scored when he didn't know what to do. I watched the Oilers on ESPN twice in the following week and he played poorly on defense *again* (although scoring some). I think it will be a travesty when he wins the Norris Trophy again. -- Rick Gillespie ARPANET: rick@LOCUS.UCLA.EDU UUCP: ...!{cepu|ihnp4|sdcrdcf|ucbvax}!ucla-cs!rick FISHNET: ...!flounder%tetra!rick@ichthys
jeff@dciem.UUCP (Jeff Richardson) (02/24/86)
> > Most of them deserved it, but picking Lee > > Fogolin and Kevin Lowe, while people like Al MacInnis, and Reed Larson > > were ignored was ridiculous. > > REED LARSON????????? You've GOT to be kidding! He's the WORST excuse for > a defenseman I've EVER seen! Take a look at the goals-allowed totals for > the Red Wings during the "Larson dynasty" and you'll see what I mean. Sure, > he has a monster slapshot but for every goal he scores he gives up two because > of his INEPT stick-handling. Any trade the Wings could make to UNLOAD this > parasite would make me happy. > > Peter Gayde (a die-hard Detroit sports fan) Mr. Gayde may be right about Larson, but I still think Sather could have done better than Lowe and Fogolin. In fact, Larson still may have been a better pick for the all-star game. He's strong offensively but weak defensively, while Lowe and Fogolin are weak offensively and strong defensively, so what's the difference? None of them are complete enough players to be called all-stars, so given the lack of complete defensemen, I'd try to even out the team representation a little better, plus I'd be more inclined to go with the offensive defenseman anyway because most people would rather see offensive than defensive stars in the all-star game. On the other hand, an offensive show is more impressive when it has to overcome some amount of defensive resistance, but I still think he picked too many Oilers. -- Jeff Richardson, DCIEM, Toronto (416) 635-2073 {linus,ihnp4,uw-beaver,floyd}!utcsri!dciem!jeff {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!dciem!jeff
jeff@dciem.UUCP (Jeff Richardson) (02/24/86)
> > Glen Sather should not be allowed to coach the All-Star team. > > Despite the fact that I'm an Oilers fan I have to agree. But I suspect > that any active coach in the league would be somewhat partisan to his > own players. The only solution that I see is to bring back a retired coach > from former years to coach and select the remaining all stars. This would > allow a more balanced team and also give the league a chance to honor > one of its former great coaches. How about Don Cherry for next years > all star team :-) :-). > Ken Hruday That sounds like a great idea to me. I see the two :-)'s in Ken's message, but I think it would be interesting to see how a team of Don Cherry's "grinder" all-stars (if Stan Jonathan and John Wensink were still in the league, Cherry would pick them above Mario Lemieux) would do against a team of more flashy stars. It would be a game I wouldn't want to miss. -- Jeff Richardson, DCIEM, Toronto (416) 635-2073 {linus,ihnp4,uw-beaver,floyd}!utcsri!dciem!jeff {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!dciem!jeff
raf@rayssd.UUCP (Ronald A. Franklin) (02/24/86)
> > Glen Sather should not be allowed to coach the All-Star team. > > Despite the fact that I'm an Oilers fan I have to agree. But I suspect > that any active coach in the league would be somewhat partisan to his > own players. The only solution that I see is to bring back a retired coach > from former years to coach and select the remaining all stars. This would > allow a more balanced team and also give the league a chance to honor > one of its former great coaches. How about Don Cherry for next years > all star team :-) :-). > Ken Hruday > University of Alberta ========================================================== How about the previous year's "coach of the year" ? It's he closest thing to "all-star coach" that I know of. -- RON FRANKLIN Raytheon Co.; Portsmouth RI; (401)-847-8000 x3974 ...!decvax!brunix!rayssd!raf ...!allegra!rayssd!raf ...!linus!rayssd!raf
absary@watdragon.UUCP (Al Sary) (02/24/86)
In article <9301@ucla-cs.ARPA> rick@ucla-cs.UUCP (Richard Gillespie) writes: >An observation for the All-Star game: Paul Coffey has regressed this year. >He may be going great guns on offense but he looks lost in his own zone. >Two of the Wales' goals were scored when he didn't know what to do. I >watched the Oilers on ESPN twice in the following week and he played >poorly on defense *again* (although scoring some). Why, when did he ever play good defense? -- Al Sary, CS Dep., U. of Waterloo, Waterloo, Ontario, Canada, N2L 3G1 UUCP: ...!{utzoo|decvax|ihnp4|clyde|allegra|linus}!watmath!watcal!absary ARPA: absary%watcal%waterloo.csnet@csnet-relay.arpa CSNET: absary%watcal@waterloo.CSNET
absary@watdragon.UUCP (Al Sary) (03/02/86)
In article <1793@dciem.UUCP> jeff@dciem.UUCP (Jeff Richardson) writes: >> ... >> Peter Gayde (a die-hard Detroit sports fan) > >Mr. Gayde may be right about Larson, but I still think Sather could have done >better than Lowe and Fogolin. In fact, Larson still may have been a better >pick for the all-star game. He's strong offensively but weak defensively, >while Lowe and Fogolin are weak offensively and strong defensively, so You can't be serious; Lowe and Fogolin strong defensively? They may be considered more defensive than Paul Coffe, but I would say their defensive abilities is questionable, and definetely not all-star caliber. >what's the difference? None of them are complete enough players to be >called all-stars, so given the lack of complete defensemen, I'd try to >even out the team representation a little better, plus I'd be more >inclined to go with the offensive defenseman anyway because most people would >rather see offensive than defensive stars in the all-star game. On the other >hand, an offensive show is more impressive when it has to overcome some amount >of defensive resistance, but I still think he picked too many Oilers. I myself enjoy watching defensive games, and cores like 2:1 or 3:2, but you may be right for an all-star game, which I usually don't seem to enjoy that much anyways. -- Al Sary, CS Dep., U. of Waterloo, Waterloo, Ontario, Canada, N2L 3G1 UUCP: ...!{utzoo|decvax|ihnp4|clyde|allegra|linus}!watmath!watcal!absary ARPA: absary%watcal%waterloo.csnet@csnet-relay.arpa CSNET: absary%watcal@waterloo.CSNET
jeff@dciem.UUCP (Jeff Richardson) (03/03/86)
> > The fans didn't do too > > badly, but I don't think they based their selections entirely on this seasons > > performances, as they should have. (Fuhr and Gosselin should not have been in > > the game; > Grant Fuhr was named outstanding player in the game. How can you argue > that he did not belong? Fuhr did play well in the All-Star game, but that doesn't prove that he deserved to be there. Any player, especially a goalie, can have an outstanding game, but All-Star selections should be based on a player's performance over the course of the season in which the voting takes place. There have been seasons in which Fuhr deserved to be the All-Star goalie, but he is not having a good season this year. At the time of the All-Star game, his goals against average was something in the neighbourhood of 4.68, with only about 20 games played and no shut-outs, numbers far worse than what you'd expect for even an average goalie playing with the best team in the league. Andy Moog's average was more than a goal a game better with about 10 more games played on the same team, and Rick Wamsley has the best goals against average in the conference with a team only slightly over .500 (St. Louis), but he was ignored in the All-Star selections! To me, Moog and Wamsley were the obvious choices for the Campbell goalies because their records this season are far better than anybody else in the conference. -- Jeff Richardson, DCIEM, Toronto (416) 635-2073 {linus,ihnp4,uw-beaver,floyd}!utcsri!dciem!jeff {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!dciem!jeff